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Spotify CEO: musicians can no longer release music only “once every 3-4 years”

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Re: Spotify CEO: musicians can no longer release music only “once every 3-4 years”

#551

I wish more people, especially tech CEOs, could understand the incredible sacrifice of time, money, and energy it takes to make an album people actually enjoy. Everything you listen to, unless you are willing to listen to raw demos, is a miracle. I've worked both as a sound engineer and and a software developer. It's orders of magnitude easier to make working software than it is to make a hit record. The way tech com…

tl;dr: Spotify performance royalties paid by PROs used to be fairer than other revenue streams, until independent labels + artists got screwed over by the major labels.

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Story time.

The streaming point values PRS for Music assigned to Spotify used to be higher per play value than many radio stations in the UK. Someone I worked with actually analysed all this and we were really surprised to discover it. Low Performing royalty revenues were not Spotify isn't paying money fairly to artists, rather Spotify knew exactly how many people streamed any given track and the royalty payout model paid based on % of total streams.

So it was actually a fairer model -- if you assume number of streams is an indicator of performance copyright value.

Compared this to the Radio model. A typical track played on BBC Radio could earn something like £80 for one play (depending on the time of day and the station). But that was because radio audience figures were estimated from sample data for the entire nation. And those samples changed something like every 1-2 years. 10 people in the country might actually be listening to the station at the time -- but you'd still get £80 regardless.

Of course the actual total license value then becomes the big point of issue -- was Spotify being charged enough...?

EMI, Sony, Warner et al. all thought no. They went and cut their own deals with Spotify. Not only was their music being treated as equal to everyone else (they didn't like that), they thought they could get a larger license revenue by dealing with Spotify directly.

So the we ended up in this really weird position: PRS for Music wasn't licensing the majority of UK royalty revenue from Spotify (the majors were) but PRS did all the processing for them (eventually GEMA took over). Leaving PRS for Music with the same workload and less bargaining power during license negotiations.

I bet you all £10 in my wallet that the artists Ek referred to as "happy" were on those major labels' rosters.

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Source: I used to work for PRS doing usage level data analysis.

Note 1: This was correct as of 5 years ago, certain things may have changed recently.

Note 2: I'm only talking about the Performing copyright. I stayed the hell away from the mess that was Mechanical rights as much as possible.

PRO: Performing Rights Organsiation

streaming point values: 1pt = 1 stream for Spotify. 1pt = 1 second of music on Radio.

royalty payout model: total points in a quarter * point value = total available license revenue for the quarter

Re: Spotify CEO: musicians can no longer release music only “once every 3-4 years”

#552
This moron's statements piss me off so deeply I don't even know where to start.

The commoditization of Music? The complete lack of understanding of how creativity works? Telling artists to "work harder" while his net worth is in the billions, all thanks to the exploitation of said artists?

All this non-sense during a terrible crisis that puts many musicians out of job since nowadays they have to rely on live performances to make a buck, all thanks to....platforms like spotify?

Can we please boycott spotify to hell?

Re: Spotify CEO: musicians can no longer release music only “once every 3-4 years”

#553

Earlier quoted context omitted.

LP's or long form collections by artists capture a moment in that artist's creative point. Typically, the cycle was release a record, tour a bunch, write new music, and repeat. This meant by the time that next LP came along, the collection of songs on there could sound fairly different as the artist changed, got better, heard new songs and got inspired etc. Then there's the recording and engineering challenges around…

I agree with what you said about albums as a cohesive piece of art, I will miss that for sure. > Forcing artists to pump out strings of singles and EPs But who is forcing the artists? The market? It's clear people don't want to listen to LPs released every 3-4 years, they want singles and EPs released frequently. If it is indeed a market effect, then artists need to evolve or perish. If you want to make money selling…

Just because there is more money is chicken McNuggets doesn’t mean they are better than fine dining.

This is just the death of another art form.

Re: Spotify CEO: musicians can no longer release music only “once every 3-4 years”

#554

Based on the Spotify revenue model my favourite artist might make a few dollars off me over our entire lifetimes. This is not enough to sustain all but the biggest artists. I am happy to contribute more to smaller artists I appreciate. Seeing them on tour, buying CDs, buying merch, patreon type models and even straight up contributions on paypal and venmo. I've been buying a couple hundred bucks worth every bandcamp…

Yep, he’s telling musicians what he wants them to optimize for his platform, which does not pay viable rates and never will. Which means if you ARE a musician you should run the other direction.

Re: Spotify CEO: musicians can no longer release music only “once every 3-4 years”

#555
Imho allow free streaming and pay for downloads of what i like. Happy to pay £10-15 direct to artist with 100% going to them. Streaming can be covered by adverts.

Simples, but apperently so far :(

Otherwise paid performance amd commissions etc are always ways to generate more revenue.

No time for diatribution companies these days.

Re: Spotify CEO: musicians can no longer release music only “once every 3-4 years”

#556

I wish more people, especially tech CEOs, could understand the incredible sacrifice of time, money, and energy it takes to make an album people actually enjoy. Everything you listen to, unless you are willing to listen to raw demos, is a miracle. I've worked both as a sound engineer and and a software developer. It's orders of magnitude easier to make working software than it is to make a hit record. The way tech com…

> It's orders of magnitude easier to make working software than it is to make a hit record. That's apples-to-oranges. Obviously a "hit" anything is hard in any field, by definition. A hit app is just as hard (even harder, probably, since there are a lot less hit apps than hit songs). But producing a single track? Seriously, it's not that hard. Yes, it takes a team of people and a lot of creativity and skill, but I do…

Have you ever composed music that others have liked? I strongly doubt so, otherwise you would refrain from comparing developing a hit app to a hit song, to save yourself the shame of looking like a fool. apple-to-oranges, as you said.

Re: Spotify CEO: musicians can no longer release music only “once every 3-4 years”

#557

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's orders of magnitude easier to make working software than it is to make a hit record. That's apples-to-oranges. Obviously a "hit" anything is hard in any field, by definition. A hit app is just as hard (even harder, probably, since there are a lot less hit apps than hit songs). But producing a single track? Seriously, it's not that hard. Yes, it takes a team of people and a lot of creativity and skill, but I do…

Not touching the whole heft of the argument, I would like to point out that the original poster didn't compare the difficulty of writing a hit song to a "hit app", he compared a creating a hit song with creating working software. I can co-sign on this part of his premise. I worked for a music producer who has a number of #1 hits (Beyonce, Fergie, John Legend etc). He wrote >1 songs per day almost every day for over a…

Can you ELI5 what a music producer does? Was he also a writer or is writing part of producing? What is placement?

Re: Spotify CEO: musicians can no longer release music only “once every 3-4 years”

#558

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Good music - electrifying, change-your-life music - is still extremely scarce. But Spotify has made it even harder to find by swamping it in mediocre burger+fries music.

Huh, this is an interesting take to me. I'd say that my using Spotify has definitely increased the amount of "bad" music I listen to, but it has _drastically_ increased the amount of amazing, life-changing music I find. There are _so_ many artists I enjoy now because Spotify threw them in my Discover Weekly. By increasing the sheer amount of music I listen to, thanks to Spotify, I've increased the number of bands I l…

There's more shit to wade through.

I really miss the days when Youtube's "related videos" were seemingly based on a graph data model -- populated like: other people that watched this, then clicked on that.

Honestly, it was far more accurate for new, niche music. My browser tabs would grow exponentially.

Now it's all sorts of weird shit like US news coverage of sentencing serial killers. Which I didn't ever watch before...

Re: Spotify CEO: musicians can no longer release music only “once every 3-4 years”

#559
post #256

I'm not sure why this is controversial. In the vinyl era, when a single LP was about 40 minutes long, it was pretty normal for artists to release roughly an album a year. (e.g. Led Zeppelin's eight studio albums were released over a span of 10.5 years, but one was a double album and they took a long break when Robert Plant's son died. The first 7 albums were released over 7 years). It seems like it was only when albu…

So why aren't all TV shows 2 episodes long now?

Re: Spotify CEO: musicians can no longer release music only “once every 3-4 years”

#560

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree, but 10s of hours of effort isn't anywhere near "more than I can imagine" as the OP said. I don't think anyone here is claiming it's easy

+ 10 years crafting a unique sound.

Tons of amazing music with totally new sounds comes from people 16-20 years old. For the right person, it doesn't take a decade.
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