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A College Degree Is No Guarantee of a Good Life

theatlantic.com

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Re: A College Degree Is No Guarantee of a Good Life

#111

Post by minicoz »

organicfigs wrote: post #99
qzx_pierri wrote: post #96

It is if you major in STEM (and you apply yourself and get internships, etc) - Majoring in "Eastern Gender Studies" will likely waste 4 years of your life.

As someone with a STEM degree who enjoyed taking online classes at a CC during their 20s in Art History, I wouldn't call it a waste of time; it's brought me more joy, balance, and a feeling of well-roundedness than I had contributing to os projects.

True, I believe it does lead to a well rounded individual to study the arts and humanities, but with the cost of a college degree, the ROI on those courses ($900 per course) is not worth the investment.

applied STEM will pay off for the investment. I still take college courses online after my Masters in CS. I really enjoy learning about humanities and arts at a cheaper CC during my free time.

Re: A College Degree Is No Guarantee of a Good Life

#112

Post by qsymmachus »

qzx_pierri wrote: post #96

It is if you major in STEM (and you apply yourself and get internships, etc) - Majoring in "Eastern Gender Studies" will likely waste 4 years of your life.

I see that STEM chauvinism is still alive and well on Hacker News.

Believe it or not, there are some skills you can pick up studying the humanities that will set you apart from your CS major peers. Being able to write and communicate clearly, for example, is pretty much a super power in most tech jobs.

Re: A College Degree Is No Guarantee of a Good Life

#113

Post by kiba »

game_the0ry wrote: post #69

No one really goes to college and grad school to learn. Higher ed is commoditized as a: * insurance policy, where students use it to avoid limiting themselves to low-status and low-paying careers * lottery ticket, the gateway to a "prestige" career track [1] * status signaling mechanism, where young people flex their educational elitism [2] And higher ed is arguably bad at what its supposed be good at - a delivery me…

And higher ed is arguably bad at what its supposed be good at - a delivery mechanism of relevant knowledge. If you have ever interviewed a fresh grad who didn't study "Cracking the Coding Interview" or did not have a few "side projects" under their belt, then you know what I am talking about.[3] The internet is the most effective information distribution delivery and it's much cheaper, no wonder the value of college is in question.

I don't think it's true. Colleges and education in general are teaching people. But it's more like drinking from a firehose.

But nobody cares about effort to retain what you drank from said firehose, so 90% to maybe 99% of it basically disappears into ether, unless you're in a profession that actually makes use of what you're taught.

Re: A College Degree Is No Guarantee of a Good Life

#114

Post by throwawaygh »

qzx_pierri wrote: post #96

It is if you major in STEM (and you apply yourself and get internships, etc) - Majoring in "Eastern Gender Studies" will likely waste 4 years of your life.

> Majoring in "Eastern Gender Studies" will likely waste 4 years of your life.

I took a bunch of art history courses that focused mostly on Asia while double majoring in STEM fields.

I'm a scientist, not a designer, but I do manage a team that includes designers. I often have to weigh in on certain design choices, and getting those choices right is often make/break for the project. The tools and skills I developed in art history courses are super helpful. As a manager or either people or product, these "soft" fields that intersect with anthro start providing a lot of value.

A good friend double-majored in music and has a similar opinion.

So, I would not recommend majoring exclusivity in an obscure humanity. But attending university without taking some upper-division humanities courses is probable a mistake.

Oh, and ignoring intro-level humanities courses is an even bigger mistake. SWEs who are weak coders can often be mentored. SWEs who can't write or communicate well are pretty much a lost cause.

Re: A College Degree Is No Guarantee of a Good Life

#115

Post by AlgorithmicTime »

bradly wrote: post #106
hectorr1 wrote: post #4

Most successful people have X. Government: “Let’s give everyone X!” Over time the value of X is diluted, loses its status signaling, and overall quality degrades. Successful people move to Y.

We give everyone in the U.S. high school education and we don't make the claims you make above. Why would higher education be different? The purpose of free higher ed for all is not to guarantee everyone a good life–it is to try and give everyone an equal chance at a good life. If higher ed is highly correlated to escaping poverty and upward economic mobility, then college costs raising at a rate 11 times faster than…

High School education was considered an actual achievement perhaps 70 years ago. Not everyone graduated. But we noticed that people who graduated high school did better, on average. So we decided to encourage people to graduate high school. Partially by force, partially by lowering standards. Now, practically everyone graduates high school, so a high school diploma is useless as a signal of quality. And so, we plan to do the same to the Bachelor's degree, except that we aren't making that free at the point of education.

Re: A College Degree Is No Guarantee of a Good Life

#116

Post by minicoz »

blaser-waffle wrote: post #56
zajio1am wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To prove intelligence and conscientiousness? Probably PhD degree.

Bollocks. Ph.Ds don't mean much unless you want to do research and provide cheap labor for 5 years. I'd say a Master's is the new BA/BS. With everyone getting an undergrad degree via online schools, or via 6+ years of undergrad college, it's ability to filter is weak. A brick-and-mortar Master's serves as a way to differentiate from that pack; I'm not sure what an online Master's equates to.

Now there are online degrees from good brick-and-mortar schools that do not mention they are online.

Georgia Techs OMSA, OMSCS, UT Austin Masters in DS, CS online.

Re: A College Degree Is No Guarantee of a Good Life

#117

Post by culopatin »

vladletter wrote: post #68

Well, this article may target white people. You can do a bootc amp and be paid. When you're part of a minority, you need a college degree to live.

Can you expand on this? I'm a minority with no degree and I'm curious about your perspective.

Re: A College Degree Is No Guarantee of a Good Life

#118

Post by ryanmarsh »

bradly wrote: post #106
hectorr1 wrote: post #4

Most successful people have X. Government: “Let’s give everyone X!” Over time the value of X is diluted, loses its status signaling, and overall quality degrades. Successful people move to Y.

We give everyone in the U.S. high school education and we don't make the claims you make above. Why would higher education be different? The purpose of free higher ed for all is not to guarantee everyone a good life–it is to try and give everyone an equal chance at a good life. If higher ed is highly correlated to escaping poverty and upward economic mobility, then college costs raising at a rate 11 times faster than…

We give everyone in the U.S. high school education and we don't make the claims you make above.

We used too. A high school education meant something to my grandparents.

Re: A College Degree Is No Guarantee of a Good Life

#120

Post by kickopotomus »

game_the0ry wrote: post #69

No one really goes to college and grad school to learn. Higher ed is commoditized as a: * insurance policy, where students use it to avoid limiting themselves to low-status and low-paying careers * lottery ticket, the gateway to a "prestige" career track [1] * status signaling mechanism, where young people flex their educational elitism [2] And higher ed is arguably bad at what its supposed be good at - a delivery me…

> No one really goes to college and grad school to learn

I did. As did many of my classmates. I've found engineering fascinating since I was a child so I enjoyed the opportunity.

> How many times have you been on a date and you tell or ask the other person where they wen to college, what they majored in, etc

How is this "[flexing] educational elitism"? That is standard small talk to gauge another person's life experience and interests.

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