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U.S. prosecutors seek 27 months imprisonment for former Uber self-driving head

reuters.com

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Re: U.S. prosecutors seek 27 months imprisonment for former Uber self-driving head

#111

Post by justSayin000001 »

ohples wrote: post #107
Simulacra wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From what I see in a cursory search, the back-up driver Rafaela Vasquez of the self-driving car that killed Elaine Herzberg was looking at their phone most of the time, which led to the fatal crash. I can't seem to find anything about this person being charged with anything. IANAL: Would this not be involuntary manslaughter at least?

Please don't use the word "accident" here. There was clearly negligence involved.

They are mutually exclusive, and both work in this case. You may not like it, but by definition they both work.

Re: U.S. prosecutors seek 27 months imprisonment for former Uber self-driving head

#113

Post by ac29 »

WrtCdEvrydy wrote: post #77
cle wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes: https://supreme.justia.com/cases/federal/us/500/453/

This is also why you should NOT attempt to dissolve drugs into drinks if you're caught with them... because they can use the liquid weight of the drink as your charged amount.

This seems like something an even mildly competent lawyer could get you off of. If a chemical is solid at room temperature, it definitely cannot be a liquid at 100% concentration.

Re: U.S. prosecutors seek 27 months imprisonment for former Uber self-driving head

#114

Post by jmpman »

nostromo wrote: post #80
jmpman wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let’s say an employee working for Bank A developed software there. Left Bank A to work for Bank B. Brought his software with him. Bank B has had to spend less money to develop that software and is more profitable had their employee not stolen the code. Bank A and Bank B are competitors. How much would this be considered theft?

A: I steal your house. You are now homeless. B: I steal the blueprints to your house. You still have a house, but you paid for an architect and I didn't. B still sucks, but almost everyone agrees A is much worse. And that's why if you steal $20m from a bank, the sentence is much worse than if you copy software that a bank spent $20m to develop.

The architect may not agree with you. He was personally impacted. It’s a matter of upholding intellectual property. I suspect the rampant justification of music pirating from the early 2000s has caused people to have defective morality circuits.

Re: U.S. prosecutors seek 27 months imprisonment for former Uber self-driving head

#115

Post by bleah1000 »

bloomboom wrote: post #19

This is a great example of unequal prosecution. A startup that has its IP copied illegally would be lucky to not be ignored by the feds. Even if it was the proximate cause of a startup’s failure (which is admittedly rare). But for Google and Goldman Sachs which never suffer any real damage in these cases, the feds are their private army capable of raiding and imprisoning anyone who copies some files illegally, even i…

Yes but it's probably really hard to prove these kinds of cases. However, Google appears to have had a large volume of evidence that would be really hard to overcome, so the prosecution has a really easy time.

With a lot of smaller companies, it's very likely that it would be a nightmare to try and prosecute and the evidence would be a lot thinner. So you are looking at an unequal outcome because the security practices of Google are probably orders of magnitude higher than any small company.

I mean, these kind of white collar crimes are hardly prosecuted at all, I can't even think of a criminal prosecution like this. I have heard of some civil cases similar to this, but very few that result in actual criminal charges. The only criminal cases I can remember, are from state actors getting caught trying to steal from corporations and then leave the country.

Re: U.S. prosecutors seek 27 months imprisonment for former Uber self-driving head

#116

Post by chrismcb »

zacksinclair wrote: post #98

> “It is, unfortunately, no exaggeration to say that a prison sentence today can amount to the imposition of a serious health crisis, even a death sentence, given the BOP’s (Federal Bureau of Prisons) current inability to control the spread of the coronavirus,” Levandowski’s attorneys wrote. I find this ridiculous for his attorneys to use as a defense against his potential incarceration. While likely true (and certai…

Whole it may be ridiculous, he is doing his job in trying to get his client of and our a weaker sentence. And yeah, any lawyer today woukd be making the same argument. Keep in mind, the constitution prohibits unusual and unjust punishment. So, or choose, conditions in prison should be brought up... By any good lawyer, at any time.

Re: U.S. prosecutors seek 27 months imprisonment for former Uber self-driving head

#117

Post by chrismcb »

ohples wrote: post #107
Simulacra wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From what I see in a cursory search, the back-up driver Rafaela Vasquez of the self-driving car that killed Elaine Herzberg was looking at their phone most of the time, which led to the fatal crash. I can't seem to find anything about this person being charged with anything. IANAL: Would this not be involuntary manslaughter at least?

Please don't use the word "accident" here. There was clearly negligence involved.

Unless it was done on purpose, then it was an accident. Negligence can be involved in an accident.

Re: U.S. prosecutors seek 27 months imprisonment for former Uber self-driving head

#118

Post by macspoofing »

jxf wrote: post #41
macspoofing wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Non-violent vs violent crime. There is a difference.

Courts have ruled that robbery is not necessarily violent. If you walk into a bank and say "Excuse me, could I trouble you for a moment of your time? Please hand me all the money in the safe", that's not violent: no threat is made, no gun is brandished, and so on. (It is still a robbery, of course.) https://blog.federaldefendersny.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/...

Are you being facetious? Because that is the biggest load of crap I've heard. There is no such thing as a non-violent bank robbery. The only reason why a bank teller would acquiesce to the demand, as polite as it is, is because there is a threat of violence. If the teller was guaranteed that no violence would occur if they denied the request, they would tell the would-be-robber to take a hike.

Re: U.S. prosecutors seek 27 months imprisonment for former Uber self-driving head

#119

Post by macspoofing »

lostlogin wrote: post #46
macspoofing wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Non-violent vs violent crime. There is a difference.

There is, and if both took $10k the violent crime deserves a harsher punishment. But when 18,000x the money is taken, there is a fair bit of hurt for a fair few people.

We live in a dyslexic era. On one end, you have people trying to argue that there is an incarceration crisis in the country and call for reforms to reduce prison sentences for non-violent offenders ... on the other end, if you read a story about a white-collar criminal, people want to increase prison sentences. Which is it?

Re: U.S. prosecutors seek 27 months imprisonment for former Uber self-driving head

#120

Post by onetimemanytime »

zacksinclair wrote: post #98

> “It is, unfortunately, no exaggeration to say that a prison sentence today can amount to the imposition of a serious health crisis, even a death sentence, given the BOP’s (Federal Bureau of Prisons) current inability to control the spread of the coronavirus,” Levandowski’s attorneys wrote. I find this ridiculous for his attorneys to use as a defense against his potential incarceration. While likely true (and certai…

Not ridiculous at all. He has been sentenced to jail, not to be infected with Covid. Whether in jail he has a higher risk of getting is a very legit defense strategy. Covid can be a life-or-death virus. Nothing is harmed by having him report to jail next year for example.
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