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A new funding model for open source software

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Re: A new funding model for open source software

#51
I remember a company doing this some time ago.

You have an account, filled with a monthly recurring amount, what ever amount that is. Then you click these "contribute" buttons, placed by the open source project webmasters in their pages.

Each click of button registers that project to your account and the site distributes your monthly amount among those registered projects.

Not able to recollect the name of the company though. Spreadrr, or Poolr or something.

Edit: Another comment got it. It's Flattr

Re: A new funding model for open source software

#52
The root of the problem is that open-source donations are made on a per-project basis. To support a project via GitHub Sponsors or OpenCollective, you must create hyet another auto-renewing monthly subscription for each project you want to support.

I don't think the author's description of GitHub Sponsors is exactly correct. Technically, the sponsorship is at the user/organization level, so if you make a donation it goes to the organization/user, which may have MULTIPLE projects going on. This is the way I have set it up for our company Plyint (https://github.com/sponsors/plyint).

Although I would very much like GitHub to implement a pool of organizations/users, which is maybe what the author meant?

Re: A new funding model for open source software

#53

If you're willing to move away from your proposed GitHub route, you could try implementing it on something like Gitcoin. The "wallet" you mentioned in the article could be a smart-contract that by the end of each month (or any desired period) would automatically make the donations directly to the crypto wallets of the projects that you chose to include in your sponsor pool. That way, you jump over some of the impleme…

> There would be no intermediary, such as GitHub, paying for the transaction fees

It sounds like there would also be no intermediary handling taxes. Each person receiving donations would be liable for dealing with taxes themselves, which could involve having to deal with the tax systems in every country/state in which one of their donors resides.

Unless your plan is to just ignore taxes and hope any tax authority that might want to come after you won't be able to obtain jurisdiction, you really want anything that involves accepting money from all over the world to go through some intermediary that operates in such a way as that intermediary is the merchant of record for the transaction.

There also might be issues with sanctions. If your country has sanctions against country X and you accept donations from someone in country X that might violate your country's laws. An intermediary can handle keeping track of that, making sure you only get donations from places that your country allows.

This could be even worse than the tax issues--at least with the tax issues it is other countries that might be trying to sue and/or prosecute you. With sanctions violations it is your own country, which is usually a lot harder to successful blow off.

Re: A new funding model for open source software

#54

Everyone thinks they deserve a dollar and can never imagine that the relative value of their code is effectively zero no matter how much it solves a particular problem. >Big projects — operating systems, frameworks, CMSs, or fully self-hostable applications — are in a privileged position to extract more value from their users, especially corporate ones Big projects aren't privileged to extract more value. They're pri…

Yeah, the market value for most of these open source packages is $0. There's nothing about charging for software that goes against the spirit of libre software. (In the 2000s, Debian and Ubuntu made money by charging for CDs of the installers.) The reason these npm-type packages can't charge is that they're extremely fungible. Left-pad, react-router, etc. are trivial and nearly identical to the next one that is given away for free. It's like news articles. The NYT article throws up a hard paywall? Then I'll just search for another story on Business Insider, Bloomberg, Reuters, some blog, etc. until I find one that's not paywalled.

What kind of software are people actually willing to pay for? Microsoft Office, Qt, AAA games, Bloomberg Terminal. You need to step your game up significantly if you want to enforce payment.

Re: A new funding model for open source software

#55

If you're willing to move away from your proposed GitHub route, you could try implementing it on something like Gitcoin. The "wallet" you mentioned in the article could be a smart-contract that by the end of each month (or any desired period) would automatically make the donations directly to the crypto wallets of the projects that you chose to include in your sponsor pool. That way, you jump over some of the impleme…

Blockchain-based solutions are a legal minefield. They attract AML and tax scrutiny and, if you've become a trustee, make it incredibly difficult to unwind the mess. "Your Honour, blockchain transactions are immutable and ledgers are composed of mixed units of account that can't be controlled and smart contracts are irreversible" will attract about as much sympathy as spitting on the gavel. When a court decides to impose equitable remedies, it won't care that you can't return gitcoin. It will seize, lien or garnish any old thing you own, because actual law is smart and smart contracts aren't.

Old-school financial arrangements aren't as cool, are much more complicated and much more expensive. But they are also vastly more robust against many, many edge conditions. High-level expertise is plentifully available to pretty much any degree of specialisation required.

Re: A new funding model for open source software

#56
post #52

The root of the problem is that open-source donations are made on a per-project basis. To support a project via GitHub Sponsors or OpenCollective, you must create hyet another auto-renewing monthly subscription for each project you want to support. I don't think the author's description of GitHub Sponsors is exactly correct. Technically, the sponsorship is at the user/organization level, so if you make a donation it…

Good point, that characterization isn't exactly accurate. Though the first-order point is that you have to go through a separate "checkout process" each time you want to sponsor a new thing.

I actually think it's important that the pools themselves contain projects not users/organizations. There are definitely complications I hadn't considered if multiple entities/organizations are listed as maintainers of a particular project. Presumably the set of maintainers would have a way to "split" the incoming donations among themselves as they see fit.

[edit] I added a footnote to address this.

Re: A new funding model for open source software

#57

If you're willing to move away from your proposed GitHub route, you could try implementing it on something like Gitcoin. The "wallet" you mentioned in the article could be a smart-contract that by the end of each month (or any desired period) would automatically make the donations directly to the crypto wallets of the projects that you chose to include in your sponsor pool. That way, you jump over some of the impleme…

> The "wallet" you mentioned in the article could be a smart-contract that by the end of each month (or any desired period) would automatically make the donations

Ethereum smart contracts don't work like that. It is push, not pull. The Ethereum world computer cannot schedule or initiate tasks without you creating and signing a transaction. Cryptocurrency just can't do subscriptions. The workaround is to send the cryptocurrency to a third-party custodial which then disburses subscription payments, but now you have regulatory hurdles, because there's a trusted entity that is holding your money.

Re: A new funding model for open source software

#58
post #54

Everyone thinks they deserve a dollar and can never imagine that the relative value of their code is effectively zero no matter how much it solves a particular problem. >Big projects — operating systems, frameworks, CMSs, or fully self-hostable applications — are in a privileged position to extract more value from their users, especially corporate ones Big projects aren't privileged to extract more value. They're pri…

Yeah, the market value for most of these open source packages is $0. There's nothing about charging for software that goes against the spirit of libre software. (In the 2000s, Debian and Ubuntu made money by charging for CDs of the installers.) The reason these npm-type packages can't charge is that they're extremely fungible. Left-pad, react-router, etc. are trivial and nearly identical to the next one that is given…

> The reason these npm-type packages can't charge is that they're extremely fungible.

I'd say it's less that they're highly substitutable (which I was I think you mean, instead of fungible) and more that they are non-excludable goods. A seller has no way to exclude a buyer from consuming opensource; that is in fact part of the definition. But without excludability, there's no incentive for a buyer to buy, other than charitable feeling. Put another way, it's a textbook example of the free-rider problem or collective action problem.

These are usually solved either with compulsion, such as taxes, subsidy or command-and-control; or they are solved by benefaction. Benefaction is what we have, as a rule. It's like how a rich patron of the arts donates to an opera company without capturing all of the subsequent value the opera creates (most is captured by the rest of the audience). Very large portions of OSS is developed by fulltime professionals whose time is essentially being given away without any meaningful way to exclude non-payers.

The other means is bundling. Mix the non-excludable part with an excludable part, such as a services contract. But OSS can always be unbundled from services or packaging . In my experience, most unbundlers radically discount the cost of doing so.

Re: A new funding model for open source software

#59
If anyone is interested, I have a simulator for pool-based funding as I'm working on a side project that uses the same approach: http://syd.jjcm.org/soci/

My project is essentially a reddit-esque site that hosts images/blogs/video/audio content. Each vote on a piece of content gives it one share of your funding pool for that month. The pool based approach is definitely the best for simple usability, but there's another aspect to it as well: it means you weigh your vote more. In the case of a social sharing/news site, low-effort content will get upvoted less, as you have to consider that every vote will dilute the pool.

I'm really bought in on this as an overall concept and I think it's something that will be extremely healthy for the web overall. Previously this was a model that was used by Flattr, but they had a major issue that not everyone was on their platform, so often times creators wouldn't get money out of a donation (because they didn't know the donation existed). I definitely agree with the author here that if this were to be done, Github themselves would have to implement it. As soon as a third party who isn't hosting the content implements it, an enormous percentage of creators wont know they have funding waiting for them and things fall apart.

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