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One hour of slow breathing changed my life

theguardian.com

201–210 of 332 posts

Re: One hour of slow breathing changed my life

#201
post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem is that you're biased - confirmation bias, expectation bias, selection bias, optimism bias, observer expectancy effect, the list goes on - and you end up learning all things except the truth.

As long as it does something beneficial who cares after all what the bias is? Placebo may play a role in it but once again, what do we care about here, whether something is beneficial or whether it can be explained why it is beneficial? For some the former and for some the latter, ofc depending on perspective.

> As long as it does something beneficial

You can't easily measure if something is beneficial. Which is precisely why a bunch of plants that people were taking before for different ailments were found to have absolutely no medical value when tried through a scientific method.

And in the age of social media, individual confirmation bias and a megaphone is the best way to promote non-science to hordes of people.

Re: One hour of slow breathing changed my life

#202

I started reading his book Breath , and he made the starting claim that, in essence, you could choose to be either energetic or restful by picking one nostril to breathe out of for awhile. (Naturally we breath out of one nostril at a time, and the body goes back and forth, but "it's a balance that can also be gamed"). I found this claim a bit... suspicious, and Googled, and didn't find much scientific evidence for th…

There’s an entire practice around this stemming from yogic philosophy called nadi shoodana —alternate nostril breathing—the theory essentially says doing this can regulate different male and female energies in the body, which are both responsible for different things, including energy levels (hyper vs relaxed). I can’t personally attest to any of the deeper claims of the theory, but I have used the alternate nostril…

If anyone wants to experience this kind of breathing in the context of a Yoga class, I really recommend this Sivananda class. It combines sun salutations with breathing exercises for really interesting experience. I have no idea on the science, but it has been a positive addition to my life.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bmMww1Wo6Tc

Re: One hour of slow breathing changed my life

#203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I guess I care. Yes it's beneficial if something works, but I want to know why it works too and not just believe in random pseudoscience. Also, determining if something really works is hard. I want to understand the mechanism. If there's something true there then you may be able to use that directly, you can also avoid untrue things that are harmful (history is full of these harmful 'treatments'). [0] Without this pe…

Humanity has historically taken a trial and error approach to most things - medicine, engineering, cooking, etc. Advances in technology are usually the result of tinkering as opposed to directed research or science. The science usually comes later (if and when someone funds it) to explain why it works. It's ugly, but it's how we usually lumber along. And yes, many mistakes and pseudoscience take place along the way.…

> Advances in technology are usually the result of tinkering as opposed to directed research or science.

In older times yes, but you can easily demonstrate that scientific progress was WAY faster once we developed actual methods to test things in a reliable way.

Re: One hour of slow breathing changed my life

#204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

With a lot of these things I would highly recommend to just try it. If it works for you, good. If not, don't do it. It doesn't cost anything and you won't harm yourself. I started yoga before it became mainstream and with a lot of the practices I tried them for myself. For example I noticed that some pranayama practices work for me and others don't. Back then pretty much every "serious" scientist or doctor would have…

> Try it. there is not much to lose. And since you can't really measure things well with n=1 you end up with confirmation bias at the end of the day.

Confirmation bias or actual personal discovery.

I don’t see what is so controversial about this. Lots of people take up exercising as a lifestyle and say they are much better for it. I don’t see what saying ‘yes but there is only one you, maybe you would have felt better without the exercise in this span if time...’ - which means statistics 101 really is not blindly applicable to all venues life. Also why bayesian statistics are sometimes much better in real life situations...

Re: One hour of slow breathing changed my life

#205
We Hindus don't just consider it as breathing, our world view is different. Breathing techniques in India are called Pranayama which means controlling prana.

This is an excerpt from chapter-3 of Raja yoga by Swami Vivekananda.

Pranayama is not as may think, something about breath. Breath indeed has very little to do with it if anything. Breathing is only one of the many exercises through which we get to the real Pranayama. Pranayama means the control of Prana. According to the philosophers of India the whole universe is composed of two materials, one of which they call Akasha, It is the omnipresent, all-penetrating existence. Everything that has form, everything that is the result of combination, is evolved out of this Akasha. It is the Akasha that becomes the air, that becomes the liquids, that becomes the solids; it is the Akasha that becomes the sun, the earth, the moon, the stars, the comets; it is the Akasha that becomes the human body, the animal body, the plants every form that we see, everything that can be sensed, everything that exists. It cannot be perceived; it is so subtle that it is beyond all ordinary perception; it can only be seen when it has become gross, has taken form. At the beginning of creation there is only this Ākāsha. At the end of the cycle the solids, the liquids, and the gases all melt into the Akasha again, and the next creation similarly proceeds out of this Akāsha.

By what power is this Akasha manufactured into this universe? By the power of Prāna. Just as Akasha is the infinite, omnipresent material of this universe, so is this Prāna the infinite, omnipresent manifesting power of this universe. At the beginning and at the end of a cycle everything becomes Akāsha, and all the forces that are in the universe resolve back into the Prāna; in the next cycle, out of this Prāna is evolved everything that we call energy, everything that we call force. It is the Prāna that is manifesting as motion; it is the Prāna that is manifesting as gravitation, as magnetism. It is the Prāna that is manifesting as the actions of the body, as the nerve currents, as thought force. From thought down to the lowest force, everything is but the manifestation of Prāna. The sum total of all forces in the universe, mental or physical, when resolved back to their original state, is called Prana.

"When there was neither aught nor naught when darkness was covering darkness, what existed then? That Akäsha existed without motion." The physical motion of the Präna was stopped, but it existed all the same.

At the end of a cycle the energies now displayed in the universe quiet down and become potential. At the beginning of the next to cycle they start up, strike upon the Akäsha, and out of the Akāsha evolve these various forms, and as the Ākāsha changes, this Prana changes also into all these manifestations of energy. The knowledge and control of this Prāna is really what is meant by Pranayama.

Re: One hour of slow breathing changed my life

#206

Earlier quoted context omitted.

With a lot of these things I would highly recommend to just try it. If it works for you, good. If not, don't do it. It doesn't cost anything and you won't harm yourself. I started yoga before it became mainstream and with a lot of the practices I tried them for myself. For example I noticed that some pranayama practices work for me and others don't. Back then pretty much every "serious" scientist or doctor would have…

A truly practical approach that can be stretched/applied to other fields of life, including business, relationships, etc. +1

That’s how most of life is. Do you get scientific measurements before having friends or having a family? Most of what we do is highly subjective. We are not as rational as we like to think.

Re: One hour of slow breathing changed my life

#207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

With a lot of these things I would highly recommend to just try it. If it works for you, good. If not, don't do it. It doesn't cost anything and you won't harm yourself. I started yoga before it became mainstream and with a lot of the practices I tried them for myself. For example I noticed that some pranayama practices work for me and others don't. Back then pretty much every "serious" scientist or doctor would have…

> Try it. there is not much to lose. And since you can't really measure things well with n=1 you end up with confirmation bias at the end of the day.

Do you constantly measure your friendships or family? Most things in life go by instinct or how they make us feel.

Re: One hour of slow breathing changed my life

#208

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As long as it does something beneficial who cares after all what the bias is? Placebo may play a role in it but once again, what do we care about here, whether something is beneficial or whether it can be explained why it is beneficial? For some the former and for some the latter, ofc depending on perspective.

> As long as it does something beneficial You can't easily measure if something is beneficial. Which is precisely why a bunch of plants that people were taking before for different ailments were found to have absolutely no medical value when tried through a scientific method. And in the age of social media, individual confirmation bias and a megaphone is the best way to promote non-science to hordes of people.

Placebo can provide actual benefit to an individual. Easing suffering, thus reducing stress levels, which in turn help body to function better.

But you are quite right, individuals with strong confirmation bias and a large social media following are harmfull.

Still, that does not mean individuals should not perform harmless experiments. Individuals should experiment. But they should not claim their findings as universal truths.

Re: One hour of slow breathing changed my life

#209
post #91

A friend of mine had pneumonia 30 years ago, and a physiotherapist told him to breathe with the abdomen as part of his treatment. I tried it for my asthma, and it worked pretty well. After a while, it came naturally and I mostly breathe this way all the time. Slowly, and from the belly :)

Also known as diaphragmatic breathing: https://my.clevelandclinic.org/health/articles/9445-diaphrag...

I was taught this as a way to control some very acute anxiety from hypochondria that took over my life for ~6 months before I could get treatment. Apparently it worked, since I haven’t suffered from that type of anxiety since.

Re: One hour of slow breathing changed my life

#210

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm sure people believe they confirm 'profound changes in their own mental state' from energy crystals too. We can delude ourselves into believing anything. That's why we need to test things empirically in order to find out the truth.

> I'm sure people believe they confirm 'profound changes in their own mental state' from energy crystals too. Not sure about you, but if someone tells me "I've been exercising lately and mentally I feel much better" I don't say "but does homeopathy really work" and wink at them.

There's a lot of evidence that exercising is healthy and helps people improve their mental state so that analogy doesn't work.

The point is if someone says they're getting a benefit from something that doesn't have a ton of evidence around it - my first instinct would be to be skeptical but curious.

When someone takes that skepticism and implies that the "far bigger and more pressing problem" is that I can't determine the obvious benefits it makes me more skeptical, not less.

How skeptical I am comes from how far it is from my priors. Breathing exercises being helpful seems likely, choosing energetic or restful based on which nostril you're breathing out of sounds like bullshit so I'm more skeptical by default.

If someone tells me they're breathing out of their right nostril to become more energized - I'd probably tell them that sounds made up.

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