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Remington Arms Declares Bankruptcy

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Re: Remington Arms Declares Bankruptcy

#71

Post by Shared404 »

throwaway-facts wrote: post #58
Shared404 wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thank you for verbalizing what I am unable to. I personally believe that there need to be large changes across the structure of gov, but to the direction of less, and not more. I have not followed the protests in Portland in depth, just enough to know that in at least portions (block? blocks?) the fed has completely reignited brutality in response to protests. Is there more info you have to available to share, or a g…

The slight sliver of hope in NYTimes is that today they wrote a story that is somewhat backtracking from full force support of the protestors: https://www.nytimes.com/2020/07/27/us/protests-divisions-blm... Quoting NYTimes: > hurled an open pocketknife at the officers guarding the courthouse; they have used power tools, crowbars and bolt cutters to yank down a fence Yep, this is going on definitely. And now we have s…

Thank you for the link. Reading it now.

The pocketknife attack appears to be according to the Portland Police Bureau. As this is a non-neutral party, I'm not sure what to believe barring video evidence.

I could lean either way on that incident, or violence in general. What it comes down to in my mind is which side is the aggressor. In this particular instance, the protesters appear to be the initial aggressors, attacking the building (Which I don't really care about) while people were still inside (Which I do care about).

That being said, most of the violence that I have seen from these protests has been firmly instigated by police, so if you take that into consideration, the police could (should?) be considered to be the initial aggressors.

In short, it's a mixed up situation with no good answers I can see. Thoughts?

Edit: Also this --

> bricks were lobbed at firefighters who were attempting to extinguish the blaze. He said he suspected that white supremacists were behind the violence.

Context for above quote: Protesters/"Protesters" set a dump truck on fire in Richmond VA.

Any thoughts on something similar to this happening in Portland to discredit protests?

Second edit: Going offline now. Will read/continue any further discussion tomorrow, if anyone wishes to.

Re: Remington Arms Declares Bankruptcy

#72

Post by jacobkania »

topkai22 wrote: post #62
stickfigure wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

REI, really? What are the superior competitors? And do you mean specifically the house-branded gear or the store as a whole? Genuinely curious, since I still shop there. Prices aren't the best but I like the selection and the return policy. Plus the salesdroids actually seem familiar with the gear.

I’m with you- REI does premium retail really well and that involves more then being just a brand. You can save money elsewhere for equivalent gear, but you won’t get the same service.

I’m a big REI fan. I’m not one of those people who hikes every week or anything, but I like to go backpacking and hiking when I can. I also have met lots of people who do the same, and REI is pretty highly regarded among most people. Their products might not be the top-end in every category, but I’ve rarely had an issue with anything bought from them. Plus their service is so outstanding, I’ve been taken care of any time there’s been a problem. It’s totally worth it to me to spend a little more, to get the peace of mind that it’s a fairly good product (they don’t sell anything horrible like you’ll get on amazon or a dept store), and that they’ll take care of any issue that does happen.

Re: Remington Arms Declares Bankruptcy

#73

Post by notmyfriend »

throwaway-facts wrote: post #51
Shared404 wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "protests" Pretty sure there are in fact protests. Regardless of your view on them, which I won't get into because this is HN and not Reddit.

I generally agree with the message of the protests but I feel like what's going on in Portland isn't being widely covered by the media. I am a long standing democrat for many years and it is becoming really difficult to stand behind the message when the activists have no agenda, want to continue doing this and there is no end in sight. I absolutely resent federal forces defending the courthouse. If protestors want to…

The bi-party system has to go for a real change to happen. Reform the congress seats to be based proportional representation and add more members. Say 10 congressmen. Party who achieves 20% gets 2 congress people etc. This lets the lunatic fringe create their own parties and leaves the traditional parties straddling the center.

Re: Remington Arms Declares Bankruptcy

#74

Post by mrexroad »

topkai22 wrote: post #62
stickfigure wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

REI, really? What are the superior competitors? And do you mean specifically the house-branded gear or the store as a whole? Genuinely curious, since I still shop there. Prices aren't the best but I like the selection and the return policy. Plus the salesdroids actually seem familiar with the gear.

I’m with you- REI does premium retail really well and that involves more then being just a brand. You can save money elsewhere for equivalent gear, but you won’t get the same service.

If you're patient, and buy exclusively at sales, REI gear is usually an decent deal for the quality when 25%-50% off. I’ve abused a number of REI bags and tents over past few years when camping with scouts, with no failures yet.

Re: Remington Arms Declares Bankruptcy

#75

Post by progre »

yaur wrote: post #31
manfredo wrote: post #3

Never owned a Remington myself, but they've not been held in high regard for a while. Some say it was linked to it's acquisition by Cerberus Capital. Ultimately, though, it seem alike the company was asking customers to pay premium prices for average guns. What justifies spending 800 - 1200 dollars on a Remington 700 as compared to $500 on a Ruger American?

I have an 870 which is a fine shotgun and not so expensive. I've got better guns in the safe, but when I want something to hunt rabbits or squirrel its still my go to.

The main model or the Express?

Re: Remington Arms Declares Bankruptcy

#76

Post by jacobush »

donw wrote: post #63
komali2 wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sounds eerily similar to the Harley situation. I had the displeasure of renting a Harley something - street 500 or something along those lines - just to see what all the fuss was about. Seems much ado about nothing, why would I drop 8,000$ on a slab of iron, not even made in the USA anymore, when I could get twice the bike at half the weight for the same price from Suzuki?

Harley screwed themselves in a lot of different ways. First, they fought to protect their market with tariffs on imported bikes -- okay, fair enough -- but then did absolutely nothing to either grow that market, or innovate on their products at all. They just kept making the same bike, the same way, for a looooooooong time. Harley's branding was 100% focused on the "60's Rebel". The Hells Angel, or the dentist that w…

And more efficient manufacturing for the conservative stuff. And better reliability, because really why not?

Re: Remington Arms Declares Bankruptcy

#77

Post by toomanybeersies »

gnarbarian wrote: post #9
manfredo wrote: post #3

Never owned a Remington myself, but they've not been held in high regard for a while. Some say it was linked to it's acquisition by Cerberus Capital. Ultimately, though, it seem alike the company was asking customers to pay premium prices for average guns. What justifies spending 800 - 1200 dollars on a Remington 700 as compared to $500 on a Ruger American?

Spot on. They are mostly a brand. None I've seen hold a candle to my 300wm Tikka t3 lite stainless I picked up for $600.

The Tikka T3 is quite possibly the best value for money bolt action rifle on the market.

In general, I've almost always found outdoor equipment from European companies to be superior to American (regardless of where it's actually manufactured). I've always got the impression from their marketing material that the Europeans are selling a product, whereas the Americans are always selling a lifestyle.

Re: Remington Arms Declares Bankruptcy

#78

Post by jacobush »

AmVess wrote: post #42
chmod600 wrote: post #14

What is the larger significance here? Does this mean the gun industry is struggling? Sounds unlikely given the spike in purchases. Maybe it's just another old company that once had a good reputation but has lost its way. PE probably involved. Or maybe there is some market shift. Like, fewer hunters purchasing lever actions and more urbanites buying semi-auto pistols.

People are buying bolt actions like there's no tomorrow. Just not from Remington. Tikka, for instance, has been a sleepy brand here in the US for a while, but their popularity has exploded in recent years. Remington's owners have stripped away many of the skilled gunsmiths they used to have. A new Remington is not a very well machined firearm, and enthusiasts have found this out and no longer buy their products.

Even the concept of gunsmiths making serial production guns is weird to me. Gunsmiths should do repair, factories with robots and CNC machines should make high precision gear.

Re: Remington Arms Declares Bankruptcy

#79

Post by PeterisP »

ralph84 wrote: post #4

No worries, another PE firm will come along to bail them out by issuing more debt and of course paying themselves a dividend. Rinse, repeat.

Well, if the lending institutions want to take on that debt, even if it would result in it being paid out in dividend and not recoverable in a bankruptcy, that's probably their right to do so - it's the lender's money to risk as they want in hopes of profit.

Re: Remington Arms Declares Bankruptcy

#80

Post by yaur »

rspeele wrote: post #66
yaur wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They sell guns, but not anything that people are panic buying.

People would absolutely panic buy a Remington 870, if it was still good. A 12GA pump is a classic "don't know much about guns but want something to keep at home" purchase, and the 870 used to be THE industry standard. But they don't make 'em like they used to. It doesn't help Remington that the quality guns they made for decades still exist on the secondary market and work just fine. So they are not only competing ag…

The 870 is still fine (I must have at least a 1000 rounds through mine) and is still something you can buy with a modest panic markup. The more ubiquitous Glock 19, which I would argue is a much less effective home defense weapon, is pretty much gone. The causes of that are more interesting than than Remington's bankruptcy.
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