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Remington Arms Declares Bankruptcy

wsj.com

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Re: Remington Arms Declares Bankruptcy

#31

Post by yaur »

manfredo wrote: post #3

Never owned a Remington myself, but they've not been held in high regard for a while. Some say it was linked to it's acquisition by Cerberus Capital. Ultimately, though, it seem alike the company was asking customers to pay premium prices for average guns. What justifies spending 800 - 1200 dollars on a Remington 700 as compared to $500 on a Ruger American?

I have an 870 which is a fine shotgun and not so expensive. I've got better guns in the safe, but when I want something to hunt rabbits or squirrel its still my go to.

Re: Remington Arms Declares Bankruptcy

#32

Post by lebaux »

komali2 wrote: post #5
manfredo wrote: post #3

Never owned a Remington myself, but they've not been held in high regard for a while. Some say it was linked to it's acquisition by Cerberus Capital. Ultimately, though, it seem alike the company was asking customers to pay premium prices for average guns. What justifies spending 800 - 1200 dollars on a Remington 700 as compared to $500 on a Ruger American?

Sounds eerily similar to the Harley situation. I had the displeasure of renting a Harley something - street 500 or something along those lines - just to see what all the fuss was about. Seems much ado about nothing, why would I drop 8,000$ on a slab of iron, not even made in the USA anymore, when I could get twice the bike at half the weight for the same price from Suzuki?

Plenty of factors are helping humans to move on from brand worship:

1. More information. The iconning brands like Harley or Marlboro are from pre-internet era and heavily relied on freedom image. It was just accepted as an expression of culture. This doesn't really work when wages are not rising with GDP. In other words, people care less about brand and more about utility and price.

2. Better and more accessible competition from around the world.

3. Influencers. I know it is cool to hate them, but there are many building a brand around "one of us". As an example, one of the most popular female youtubers is doing shopping "hauls" in regular shops. You probably don't know that, why would HN watch beauty youtubers. But consider this. Linus Tech Tips is also influence marketing and you can see him talking about Linux, cheap peripherals, bashing Intel. Every category has its Linus. These people have tremendous pull, especially since younger people don't watch TV at all.

4. COVID-19. I speculate that the pandemic exposed how many companies have no reserves (either to low profits or simple because the executives are draining profits).

5. ...and many more, feel free to add.

Re: Remington Arms Declares Bankruptcy

#34

Post by markdown »

zrobotics wrote: post #17
axegon_ wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same, as far as firearms are concerned. But I do own several other Remington products and the quality is astonishing. One of which is a pocket knife and it's staggering how well made it is. And how outrageously sharp it is for that matter. 3 days before the pandemic started I nearly cut off my left index finger with it...

I will say, those are licensed products. They may be good, but that's luck of the draw, they have just sold the brand name off to some 3rd party to make a specific product. For what it's worth, I bought a remington-branded bone saw ~3 years back, and it was absolute garbage. It failed to even finish field dressing an elk, and all that was required was one cut of a few inches. It's a shame, their older products were r…

Probably made in China. For high quality bone saws, look no further than Saudi Arabia.

Re: Remington Arms Declares Bankruptcy

#36

Post by paulie_a »

chmod600 wrote: post #14

What is the larger significance here? Does this mean the gun industry is struggling? Sounds unlikely given the spike in purchases. Maybe it's just another old company that once had a good reputation but has lost its way. PE probably involved. Or maybe there is some market shift. Like, fewer hunters purchasing lever actions and more urbanites buying semi-auto pistols.

Honestly no. If anything the gun industry holds a substantial bit of political power considering the average American doesn't even own a gun.

Edit:. Touchy subject but it's a fact the average American doesn't own a gun. The political influence is substantial on the other hand. I'm not anti gun because it should be an inconsequential topic. It's like vegans had the big seat at the table.

Re: Remington Arms Declares Bankruptcy

#37

Post by purpleidea »

From the article:

Gun stores, which have largely stayed open during the Covid-19 pandemic, are selling to many first-time buyers worried about personal safety over the civil unrest that followed the killing of George Floyd in police custody and the ensuing movement to reduce police funding.

Re: Remington Arms Declares Bankruptcy

#38

Post by takeda »

komali2 wrote: post #5
manfredo wrote: post #3

Never owned a Remington myself, but they've not been held in high regard for a while. Some say it was linked to it's acquisition by Cerberus Capital. Ultimately, though, it seem alike the company was asking customers to pay premium prices for average guns. What justifies spending 800 - 1200 dollars on a Remington 700 as compared to $500 on a Ruger American?

Sounds eerily similar to the Harley situation. I had the displeasure of renting a Harley something - street 500 or something along those lines - just to see what all the fuss was about. Seems much ado about nothing, why would I drop 8,000$ on a slab of iron, not even made in the USA anymore, when I could get twice the bike at half the weight for the same price from Suzuki?

But does Suzuki make noise as if a muffler fell off?

Re: Remington Arms Declares Bankruptcy

#39

Post by zrobotics »

komali2 wrote: post #5
manfredo wrote: post #3

Never owned a Remington myself, but they've not been held in high regard for a while. Some say it was linked to it's acquisition by Cerberus Capital. Ultimately, though, it seem alike the company was asking customers to pay premium prices for average guns. What justifies spending 800 - 1200 dollars on a Remington 700 as compared to $500 on a Ruger American?

Sounds eerily similar to the Harley situation. I had the displeasure of renting a Harley something - street 500 or something along those lines - just to see what all the fuss was about. Seems much ado about nothing, why would I drop 8,000$ on a slab of iron, not even made in the USA anymore, when I could get twice the bike at half the weight for the same price from Suzuki?

Speaking as someone who owns a 64 panhead and owned a 72 ironhead (rebuilt both from parts): Harleys have almost always been inferior bikes that have a strange sort of charm. Realistically, they occupy the same place as Ural, outdated bikes that have appeal mostly for style. The last time that Harley had anything cutting-edge (ignoring Buell) was likely the knucklehead, which was developed in the 30s.

$8k will buy you a used one (not new), but there is a damn good reason there are used Harleys with essentially zero miles avaliable everywhere. I have fun riding my antique crap, but the new ones are such crappy bikes for the money. A new BMW is the same money, for a more comfortable bike that is less maintenance cost. However, I used to live on the route to Sturgis for most of Colorado, Arizona, and western Texas, and I saw probably 80% trailers vs bikes. People don't buy them to ride them, they buy them to fulfill their midlife crisis.

To further derail, I would argue Jack Daniel's, Levis, and REI are in the same boat- they are grossly overpriced compared to superior competitors and mostly trade on name brand and perception of past quality.

Re: Remington Arms Declares Bankruptcy

#40

Post by ponker »

sharken wrote: post #29
onetimemanytime wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> Some say it was linked to it's acquisition by Cerberus Capital. History repeats itself. As if these companies care about the brand reputation over decades, they just want to milk it and then sell it to idiots (public) that recognize the name. People are buying more guns than ever, so it was probably a planned bankruptcy

EDIT: Point taken with the downvotes. This feels very similar to the Intel story, except it seems that Intel is aware and will rectify the problem. But less gun companies overall is a Good Thing in my opinion.

I can't think of two more dissimilar stories than Remington and Intel. This is like saying "The Color Purple" feels very similar to "The Da Vinci Code."
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