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Headphones are collecting too much personal data (2019)

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Re: Headphones are collecting too much personal data (2019)

#401

Post by renewiltord »

La1n wrote: post #355
renewiltord wrote: post #299

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, but they deserve to be able to make the choice too. So if you move to a world where selling your data for services isn't available, then you're forcing them to pay and since we've determined they can't pay, all you're doing is removing the choice from them and forcing them in to the no-service option. And I know how it is because I was once affected by this. All these "but the poor people" folks disappear when…

>So if you move to a world where selling your data for services isn't available, then you're forcing them to pay and since we've determined they can't pay, all you're doing is removing the choice from them and forcing them in to the no-service option. Like this is the only option... We already see a lot of services that sell multiple tiers of their products, with power users or larger companies paying significantly m…

Oh and now they don't deserve this better service and you've made the choice for them. No thanks.

So eager to remove choices from someone else.

Re: Headphones are collecting too much personal data (2019)

#402

Post by arexxbifs »

renewiltord wrote: post #400
arexxbifs wrote: post #378

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’ve lived in a world similar to that. It was called the 1990s. It wasn’t particularly expensive, it wasn’t that hard to book hotels and, amazingly, people also got invited to parties and events. Also, your headphones didn’t spy on you.

This is how you know you were wealthy. Everything was so much more expensive then. I remember even trying to get maps or a digital marker for where you were required so much money. Noise canceling headphones? Forget about it. And if you weren't in America with money, you could barely do anything online. Hotels, air travel? So expensive. Way cheaper now. TVs? So cheap now. And where I lived you couldn't even book your…

I can assure you I'm not wealthy and never have been, other than in the sense of me living in the west (though not the US). My point is that life can be pretty damn decent without digital markers for where you are, constant air travel and a new TV every other year.

Yes, certain things have gotten more affordable. But is affordable noise cancelling headphones and cheap air travel really the result of apps and websites crawling up our backsides with a microscope and shuffling that data to some unknown other?

Air travel in the 1990s was much cheaper than, say, in the 1950s, much like computers, TV:s and headphones. In fact, the price of air travel dropped by roughly 1/3 between 1980 and 1995[0].

Evidence suggests that happened completely without constant digital surveillance.

[0] https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2013/02/how-air...

Re: Headphones are collecting too much personal data (2019)

#403

Post by andrewmackrodt »

strogonoff wrote: post #395
andrewmackrodt wrote: post #363

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've owned the Sony WH-1000XM2 for several years and while the Android app location collection is unnecessary, ear data is entirely optional. You have a valid point that the app can misbehave regarding updates and lack of internet connection. I personally find myself never using the app, it only really provides 3 somewhat useful features; equalisation (which forces the audio codec to SBC which is inferior to LDAC so…

I immediately deleted Sony’s app after disabling EQ and probably some other gimmicks on my XM3s—has worked alright with Apple devices. (Well, as ‘alright’ as could be expected. Switching between devices requires slow re-pairing through long power button press, but I don’t think Sony’s app would’ve resolved that.)

This is one area Bose are notably better in, i.e. connected to two devices simultaneously. I find the XM2 can remember pairing for at least 2 devices, typically my phone and laptop but I have to manually disconnect from one device and connect using the other when switching. This is quicker than entering pairing mode but still an upto 30 second process, but much of that time is due to the awkward Bluetooth settings menu in recent versions of gnome.

Re: Headphones are collecting too much personal data (2019)

#404

Post by cactus2093 »

therealdrag0 wrote: post #398
cactus2093 wrote: post #342

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I didn’t find that an issue at all, and not sure what you mean about the laptop part I only use the mobile app to upgrade my qc 35s. I do find the Bose UX to be horrible though for another reason, which is the incredibly stupid “feature” that the headphones can be connected to multiple devices at once. Since I use it both with my phone and laptop and they’re often in range of each other, sometimes the audio control w…

I love this feature, but Mac is the bully in this situation. It captures the connection often even when nothing is playing and when Mac is asleep it still tries to connect and probably due to low power mode takes FOREVER for the phone to sync and realize what I actually want is to play audio from my phone not laptop... I found this project which helps with the later problem: https://github.com/odlp/bluesnooze

Yeah maybe this is another case of walled garden apple stuff where it only works well if you're 100% in their ecosystem. They seem to have very chatty bluetooth headphone code in general, like the airpods are effectively always in pair mode you don't have to hold a button down or anything to get them to start pairing to another device. But the end result is it does work with fewer headaches than my Bose QC35 and is still just as easy to switch between devices. And apparently there are further improvements with that coming in iOS14 too.

Re: Headphones are collecting too much personal data (2019)

#405

Post by charwalker »

niklasd wrote: post #182
monksy wrote: post #167

The article should have buried sony for how egregious they are. They require the app to collect location information, and ear. https://www.sony.com/electronics/support/articles/00233341 I'm not sure what else they collect.. but those are the 2 bad ones. They've got a few settings that are software controlled (one being the bluetooth's internal volume) What happens if you get a software update and you open the app on…

I recently tried out wireless noise-cancelling headphones from both Bose and Sony, and (the important privacy issues aside) the user experience with these apps is just horrible. You unpack your Bose headphone, eager to use them. But before that, you have to download an app on the iPhone, then download a software update program on your laptop, which in turn opens a program in the browser that downloads an update, then…

The Jabra 85h is great in this regard. Totally fine without the app, the app itself has a ton of features and useful items including changes to side tone and auto noise cancellation. The app pulled in a firmware update when I first connected and ran that in a few minutes without me touching anything. I would like to compare my set to the top Bose and Sony sets but at almost double the price of the 85h, I can't bring myself to spend the money.

Re: Headphones are collecting too much personal data (2019)

#406

Post by charwalker »

renewiltord wrote: post #120
saurik wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They care. It exudes as a cynicism about the world and continual jokes about talking to the FBI agent assigned to watch them. They (as are we) are just powerless to prevent it as every single service and every single platform and apparently every single product is collecting data on us. And since the value of services and platforms and, sadly, even products goes up as more people are using them, the arguments of "don…

That sounds like you do have a choice: spend more money. In a world where this wasn't allowed, presumably you'd be forced to spend more money. So you can inhabit that world right now if you want.

Bose and Sony, 2 of the most expensive tech product companies, are the example here. The option is buy your sub $10 wired skull candy earbuds and ignore anything that's more expensive because it isn't an option. It's the same reason recent generations grew p on fast food, it's cheaper and easier and all some people have resources for.

Re: Headphones are collecting too much personal data (2019)

#407

Post by Florin_Andrei »

rorykoehler wrote: post #376
Florin_Andrei wrote: post #360

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The DT-990 are not bad. The treble is a little overemphasized. The easy bass is also a bit emphasized, but then they give up on the deep bass (start dropping below 50 Hz). Still good headphones, two classes above the uncorrected Sony NC. With proper corrections based on objective measurements, any headphones can sound neutral and balanced.

What you're hearing in the DT-990 is the open back. I'm not sure on your assessment regarding any headphone. you'll never get the noise cancelling ones sounding good because there are 2 processes affecting the sound. Also the hardware itself needs to be capable.

> What you're hearing in the DT-990 is the open back.

That's just an audiophile meme, there's no reality to it.

> you'll never get the noise cancelling ones sounding good because there are 2 processes affecting the sound

That's so wrong I'm not even sure where to begin refuting it.

Seems like you're picking a lot of audiophile mythology along the way.

Re: Headphones are collecting too much personal data (2019)

#408

Post by [deleted] »

Florin_Andrei wrote: post #407
rorykoehler wrote: post #376

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What you're hearing in the DT-990 is the open back. I'm not sure on your assessment regarding any headphone. you'll never get the noise cancelling ones sounding good because there are 2 processes affecting the sound. Also the hardware itself needs to be capable.

> What you're hearing in the DT-990 is the open back. That's just an audiophile meme, there's no reality to it. > you'll never get the noise cancelling ones sounding good because there are 2 processes affecting the sound That's so wrong I'm not even sure where to begin refuting it. Seems like you're picking a lot of audiophile mythology along the way.

[deleted]

Re: Headphones are collecting too much personal data (2019)

#409

Post by pwdisswordfish2 »

MereInterest wrote: post #317
pwdisswordfish2 wrote: post #186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is an even easier analysis. If you were designing your own headphones just for your own use, would you have them collect personal data? If your answer is no, then choosing headphones that do not collect data is a logical choice. The author cites some idea of "trading" ongoing collection of personal data^1 for features but I can't see how that applies here, assuming the user has already paid for the product, e.g…

I'd put it a bit differently. If I were designing headphones for my own use, would I have them collect personal data and then give that data to somebody else . I like collecting statistics about myself, because they are interesting. For example, tracking exactly when I go to sleep, start my commute (pre-corona, that is), go on errands. But that is data that is for my use, and not something that I would trust in someb…

Would you store the personal data in "the cloud" (i.e., remotely accessible shared computer)

Re: Headphones are collecting too much personal data (2019)

#410

Post by IgniteTheSun »

qwerty456127 wrote: post #252

We just should to stop tolerating conventional things using Internet connection. There is no way headphones really need an Internet-connected app to work and even to let you use advanced functions (i.e. all the configuration can be implemented in a purely offline app). And if they don't need they should not even nudge, let alone require, you to install such. Most of the people just don't give a uck, somebody competen…

"We just should to stop tolerating conventional things using Internet connection."

Given IoT and 5G how can you stop this?

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