Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Headphones are collecting too much personal data (2019)

soundguys.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

361–370 of 431 posts

Re: Headphones are collecting too much personal data (2019)

#361

Post by josteink »

andrewflnr wrote: post #222
josteink wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’ve had the best heat headphones Bose has to offer in the Quiet Comfort series and to me this “state of the art noise cancellation” sounds like artefact- and distortion-inducing noise. I’ve returned them and replaced them with much better, naturally damping, closed head-phones. And the audio is so much better, at a fraction of the cost. Noise cancellation in the hifi-space is just snake oil, and I’m not having it.

Does... does anyone actually think noise-cancelling is for increasing audio quality? I always thought it was just for handling obnoxiously noisy environments, like airplanes, screaming children, etc.

> Does... does anyone actually think noise-cancelling is for increasing audio quality?

No, but noise cancelling headsets are often sold as premium headsets, with the obvious implication that they are to have high sound-quality. And quite often, they don’t.

Re: Headphones are collecting too much personal data (2019)

#362

Post by DanielleMolloy »

To those only looking for the noise cancelling component of modern headphones: I was only interested in this as I already have a good pair of (wired, offline) hi-fi headphones, and given some HN comments on this I decided for Peltor x5a passive noise cancelling earmuffs. No batteries to charge and become disfunctional with time, no spy-apps, no potential hearing damage from ANC (not sure what the status is here), no cables, no bluetooth issues; and you get Peltors for 15-30$ so no problem if they break because you stored them in the bottom of a bag. My growing collection of low tech might look a bit dorky but I love it.

Re: Headphones are collecting too much personal data (2019)

#363

Post by andrewmackrodt »

monksy wrote: post #167

The article should have buried sony for how egregious they are. They require the app to collect location information, and ear. https://www.sony.com/electronics/support/articles/00233341 I'm not sure what else they collect.. but those are the 2 bad ones. They've got a few settings that are software controlled (one being the bluetooth's internal volume) What happens if you get a software update and you open the app on…

I've owned the Sony WH-1000XM2 for several years and while the Android app location collection is unnecessary, ear data is entirely optional.

You have a valid point that the app can misbehave regarding updates and lack of internet connection. I personally find myself never using the app, it only really provides 3 somewhat useful features; equalisation (which forces the audio codec to SBC which is inferior to LDAC so I've never used it); automatic profile switching, e.g. ambient sound if detecting you are walking and finally, the level of noise cancellation to apply.

This model has a dedicated switch on the headphones to change the profile where a long press even "calibrates" the sound based on atmospheric pressure, not sure I buy into that gimmick, but they're perfectly useable without the app. I have them paired with Android, Windows, macOS and Linux and all work perfectly (with the minor exception being Linux does not support Bluetooth absolute volume). The headphones also support volume control from the unit for devices which have an older Bluetooth stack which does not support absolute volume.

Overall, I agree the app needs improvement but I'm not sure there's anything that warrants burying the company of these decisions. I suspect for many users, the app is entirely useless and not worth installing.

Re: Headphones are collecting too much personal data (2019)

#364

Post by panpanna »

monksy wrote: post #167

The article should have buried sony for how egregious they are. They require the app to collect location information, and ear. https://www.sony.com/electronics/support/articles/00233341 I'm not sure what else they collect.. but those are the 2 bad ones. They've got a few settings that are software controlled (one being the bluetooth's internal volume) What happens if you get a software update and you open the app on…

> Clicking "don't accept" pushes you back to the tos screen.

This is a textbook example of a GDPR violation. In fact, it is a clear violation of the first of the five requirements for consent.

See recital 43:

"... Consent is presumed not to be freely given if it does not allow separate consent to be given to different personal data processing operations despite it being appropriate in the individual case, or if the performance of a contract, including the provision of a service, is dependent on the consent despite such consent not being necessary for such performance."

Re: Headphones are collecting too much personal data (2019)

#365

Post by lm28469 »

trickstra wrote: post #312
rkagerer wrote: post #307

When you buy food there's a label on the package that tells you what's in it. When you buy cigarettes there's a big warning label about the risk to your health. I think consumer devices need something like that. Imagine browsing an aisle and seeing a label on the package like "WARNING: These earbuds phone home with the track names you play, your GPS location and menstruation cycle history." How many people do you thi…

But... they do. When you install the app, people routinely agree with "This app wants access to your contact list, storage, internet, and to run at startup". But I get your point, it should be on the box, before you buy the hardware. Currently they can easily argue that you can install the software from appstore, check the required permissions, before even buying the hardware. But that's not enough.

> "This app wants access to your contact list, storage, internet, and to run at startup"

If you don't agree most of the time the app quits and you can't use the product you bought.

Re: Headphones are collecting too much personal data (2019)

#366

Post by everdrive »

When I was younger, I was wondering what it would feel like to to feel 'left behind' by technology. I remember helping so many adults to navigate a world they didn't understand. They'd ask "left click or right click?" every time I asked them to use their mouse. They just couldn't grasp some of the context.

This is not quite the same thing, but I'm starting to feel that perhaps I am starting to witness that same disconnect. Having read the title alone, I wondered "how are the headphones collecting data?" Oh, there's an app. Why would you need an app for headphones? It simply never occurred to me.

Re: Headphones are collecting too much personal data (2019)

#367

Post by kkapelon »

vladTheInhaler wrote: post #290

I see a lot of people talking about Bose and Sony and their awful apps, but there are alternatives! I have been using my Sennheiser PXC 550's for almost a year now with no software updates or other nonsense. If it has an app, I certainly don't know about it. About the only complaint I have is how easy it is to accidentally hang up on someone with the touch controls on the ear. Normally I support more organized soluti…

It has an app.

And unfortunately the app is the only way to set noise reduction to any level other than 0%, 50%, 100% (that is available with the hardware button).

If for example you want noise reduction to 75% you need to use the app.

Same for changing the sound profiles from the defaults.

Re: Headphones are collecting too much personal data (2019)

#368

Post by kkapelon »

flukus wrote: post #341
p1esk wrote: post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Good luck with this if you want state of the art in noise canceling

Have there been large advances in noise cancelling since 3.5mm jacks started to disappear?

Maybe not.

But if you want to buy headphones today with NC, most of them will be wireless.

Re: Headphones are collecting too much personal data (2019)

#369

Post by kkapelon »

starky wrote: post #70
qmmmur wrote: post #51

Mine don't because they're hard wired into whatever device I use.

Exactly, it will be a cold day in hell before I buy a pair of headphones that I have to charge on order to make them work or have any "smart" features.

I was like you, until I tried wireless headphones outside and was amazed.

For some activities like running having no cables to deal with is a great experience (that you should try at least once)

Post reply on HN