Headphones are collecting too much personal data (2019) • Hacker News Board

Re: Headphones are collecting too much personal data (2019)

#81

Post by ubercow13 » Sun, Jul 26, 2020, 5:16 PM UTC

snvzz wrote: post #77

Bluecobra wrote: post #12

Ahh, this is real reason why the phone manufacturers want to get rid of the headphone jack. I was so naive to think it was only about DRM/licensing.

As usual, if there's no headphone jack, I won't buy that device. Privacy isn't even the deal breaker there. Latency and the ability to use my favourite set (Sennheiser HD600) are.

Can a phone reasonably drive such high-impedance headphones anyway?

Re: Headphones are collecting too much personal data (2019)

#82

Post by ta17711771 » Sun, Jul 26, 2020, 5:19 PM UTC

ubercow13 wrote: post #81

snvzz wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As usual, if there's no headphone jack, I won't buy that device. Privacy isn't even the deal breaker there. Latency and the ability to use my favourite set (Sennheiser HD600) are.

Can a phone reasonably drive such high-impedance headphones anyway?

Could be a comfort thing, could be a "don't want to throw away perfectly good hardware" thing.

Re: Headphones are collecting too much personal data (2019)

#83

Post by coliveira » Sun, Jul 26, 2020, 5:19 PM UTC

The sad thing is that many people will think it is Ok to give them this kind of private information, just in exchange for some crappy, useless app. 20 years ago, if somebody said they cared about how many steps they walked, or how many minutes they slept more than last month, or how many minutes they looked at the computer, you would classify them as mentally sick. Except for specialists that do research in these areas, there is no reason to keep tabs on minutiae like this. This whole industry is training people to behave as the mentally retarded, and give away all their private information for nothing.

Re: Headphones are collecting too much personal data (2019)

#84

Post by vladvasiliu » Sun, Jul 26, 2020, 5:20 PM UTC

imglorp wrote: post #42

Lio wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You also can't get firmware updates if you don't install the companion app and allow them to spy on you.

Or just update your firmware and then remove the app. Not just Bose, the Sony WH* series is also guilty of this. Great cans, awful app.

I'm curious about the Sony App. What information does it get from the phone? The only kind of sensitive permission it asks for is location, and arguably there's a functionality related to that (change the adaptive sound reduction as a function of where you are). The other permission it asked for is Bluetooth, which I guess is expected since it uses that to talk to the headphones. It never asked for anything else.

I didn't allow it to get my location and I can still get firmware updates and can use it to confirm the codec in use (that's the main reason I have it installed).

Re: Headphones are collecting too much personal data (2019)

#85

Post by BTCOG » Sun, Jul 26, 2020, 5:21 PM UTC

Lio wrote: post #20

gruez wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't this really only an issue if you use the companion app? I doubt the usb-c/lightning/bluetooth headphones can exfiltrate data if you don't have the companion app installed.

You also can't get firmware updates if you don't install the companion app and allow them to spy on you.

Why on EARTH would anyone EVER need to update firmware for a pair of headphones? That's asinine.

Re: Headphones are collecting too much personal data (2019)

#86

Post by BTCOG » Sun, Jul 26, 2020, 5:22 PM UTC

imglorp wrote: post #42

Lio wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You also can't get firmware updates if you don't install the companion app and allow them to spy on you.

Or just update your firmware and then remove the app. Not just Bose, the Sony WH* series is also guilty of this. Great cans, awful app.

Great headphones would never require an app or updating of the firmware. They should play music as engineered and intended from day one of the purchase of said heaphones, until they no longer work.

Re: Headphones are collecting too much personal data (2019)

#87

Post by bdefore » Sun, Jul 26, 2020, 5:24 PM UTC

ubercow13 wrote: post #81

snvzz wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As usual, if there's no headphone jack, I won't buy that device. Privacy isn't even the deal breaker there. Latency and the ability to use my favourite set (Sennheiser HD600) are.

Can a phone reasonably drive such high-impedance headphones anyway?

With a pocketsize amp yes.

When at my desk, I plug in through a Mont Blanc FiiO for my Beyerdynamic headphones. Makes a big difference with some audio. Wireless buds are obviously already a step down from wired, and one step further from amplified cans. And yeah, I'm an outlier and want to be.

Re: Headphones are collecting too much personal data (2019)

#88

Post by Godel_unicode » Sun, Jul 26, 2020, 5:25 PM UTC

ubercow13 wrote: post #81

snvzz wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As usual, if there's no headphone jack, I won't buy that device. Privacy isn't even the deal breaker there. Latency and the ability to use my favourite set (Sennheiser HD600) are.

Can a phone reasonably drive such high-impedance headphones anyway?

As one data point, the headphone jack-having iPhone would drive 26.39 mW into 33 ohms, which means that at max volume you'd be damaging your ears at a volume of around 100dB with the 300ohm impedance and 105dB/mW SPL.

So yes, the previous poster could conceivably be doing the thing that they said they were doing.

Re: Headphones are collecting too much personal data (2019)

#89

Post by sudosysgen » Sun, Jul 26, 2020, 5:25 PM UTC

ubercow13 wrote: post #81

snvzz wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As usual, if there's no headphone jack, I won't buy that device. Privacy isn't even the deal breaker there. Latency and the ability to use my favourite set (Sennheiser HD600) are.

Can a phone reasonably drive such high-impedance headphones anyway?

My LG phones can drive monster planar magnetic headphones easily, HD600 are nothing as long as you buy a phone with a good amp.

Re: Headphones are collecting too much personal data (2019)

#90

Post by hanche » Sun, Jul 26, 2020, 5:27 PM UTC

formerly_proven wrote: post #36

dangoor wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There were two things that happened when Apple got rid of the headphone jack: (1) they added water resistance, (2) the phones got thinner. Plus, Apple had seen the trends heading toward wireless headphones. They still included a dongle to give you a standard headphone jack. While Apple could likely have gotten their water resistance even with the headphone jack, they couldn’t have made the phones as thin. People may…

> the phones got thinner No. They didn't. iPhone 5: 7.6 mm thin, 6: 7 mm iPhone 7: 7.1 mm > While Apple could likely have gotten their water resistance even with the headphone jack, they couldn’t have made the phones as thin. Except that's a pretty obvious lie. Not just that the phones did not get thinner (or lighter), they stayed around the same thickness (+- 0.5 mm), while getting larger, much heavier and much more…

The explanation/excuse I recall seeing, was about space, not thickness. The headphone jack takes up space inside the phone that they’d rather put to other uses, like more battery for example. At least, that seems to make a bit more sense.