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Put tiny businesses back into residential neighborhoods

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Re: Put tiny businesses back into residential neighborhoods

#11

Post by madamelic »

zip1234 wrote: post #8
Animats wrote: post #7

It's like having a convenience store in the lobby of an apartment building. Seems like a great idea, but it takes a huge apartment building, or a city block of modest ones, to support a convenience store. Vending machines, maybe. We see this with all those "mixed use" buildings going up in Silicon Valley, with retail spaces on the ground floor. It's really hard to fill those retail spaces.

The problem is that all of those places are planned. I get major 'Soviet Central Planning' vibes from the USA when it comes to zoning and planning out cities. Of course the people making the decisions on planning have no idea what will work. They only know what will work in the most rudimentary, scaled up, sense. Small shops need to be allowed everywhere, rules about minimum parking, lot sizes, use, etc need to be re…

Suburbs are literally rooted in racism.

That sounds hyperbolic, but the first suburb in post-war US was a planned whites-only community to escape the city. (Levittown)

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With that said, yes, the US purposefully planned blocks of cities to be dedicated to one purpose. This promotes car culture which, surprise surprise, car and oil companies were big into lobbying to shut down mixed use and public transit, and continue to be.

Mixed use areas are typically either big cities, have pre-war origins where it has basically always been mixed use or typically both.

Re: Put tiny businesses back into residential neighborhoods

#12

Post by rgacote »

I've found that it is typical for people who run these small types of businesses also live in the neighborhood, or close by.

Another improvement is that people who both live and work in the community have time for more community engagement, but it their children's schools, local government, or local volunteer efforts.

Local businesses improve the community.

Re: Put tiny businesses back into residential neighborhoods

#13

Post by aahhahahaaa »

How did we slip away so far from this being fairly obvious? Cities have worked well this way for hundreds of years.

Maybe the industrial revolution made cities too unpleasant? Were we too spoiled by the automobile industry and government roads? White flight from cities into the suburbs?

Re: Put tiny businesses back into residential neighborhoods

#14

Post by aahhahahaaa »

Animats wrote: post #7

It's like having a convenience store in the lobby of an apartment building. Seems like a great idea, but it takes a huge apartment building, or a city block of modest ones, to support a convenience store. Vending machines, maybe. We see this with all those "mixed use" buildings going up in Silicon Valley, with retail spaces on the ground floor. It's really hard to fill those retail spaces.

Well of course, who can afford the rent? It's not like a little four-employee computer repair shop can show up and fill the space.

Re: Put tiny businesses back into residential neighborhoods

#15

Post by lotsofpulp »

aahhahahaaa wrote: post #13

How did we slip away so far from this being fairly obvious? Cities have worked well this way for hundreds of years. Maybe the industrial revolution made cities too unpleasant? Were we too spoiled by the automobile industry and government roads? White flight from cities into the suburbs?

People wanted their children to be separate from people of other socioeconomic classes (and races), and the way to do that in the US is to move to a school district they others can’t afford.

Re: Put tiny businesses back into residential neighborhoods

#16

Post by oftenwrong »

The more people within "walking distance" the less need for a parking lot. There are a number of successful businesses in my neighbourhood with zero parking or minimal parking. Many customers can arrive by foot (or bike or bus). Even a small scrap of land can be a prime location.

If you visit the outskirts of the city, there is a large difference. The parking lot is like an ocean. After all, every customer must arrive by car. You need a massive tract of land to have a successful business in such an environment.

Next time you visit a business, pop open your maps app on your phone and look at the satellite view. Note the size of the building in relation to its parking lot. It is not unusual for the parking lot to occupy more land than the actual store, even in urban areas.

Re: Put tiny businesses back into residential neighborhoods

#17

Post by toofy »

For a few years I’ve wondered how possible it would be for large neighborhood associations to own a neighborhood grocery store.

I haven’t bothered yet to run the numbers, but I would expect if the association was large enough it wouldn’t add much cost.

Residents could get a substantial discount while non-residents could pay normal prices. Residents could put in subscription style orders for things they would always regularly need. It would make it easier to order specialty things that normal groceries stores wouldn’t carry, etc...

Re: Put tiny businesses back into residential neighborhoods

#18

Post by SaltyLemonZest »

Animats wrote: post #7

It's like having a convenience store in the lobby of an apartment building. Seems like a great idea, but it takes a huge apartment building, or a city block of modest ones, to support a convenience store. Vending machines, maybe. We see this with all those "mixed use" buildings going up in Silicon Valley, with retail spaces on the ground floor. It's really hard to fill those retail spaces.

The mixed use buildings you're referring to are approaching from the wrong direction. They're 1960s style office parks - sometimes a modern reinvention of them, sometimes literally a redevelopment on the same land - and you can't get a meaningful mixed use space in an area where everyone drives in at 9 and drives out at 5.

Re: Put tiny businesses back into residential neighborhoods

#19

Post by kerkeslager »

A simple rule that I think would improve a lot of communities: any retail-zoned business (stores, restaurants, etc.) must be owned with a controlling interest by people with a residency within 10 miles.

I don't really see much point focusing on the size of buildings. Fix the money and the other issues will follow.

EDIT: If you think I'm wrong feel free to explain why.

Re: Put tiny businesses back into residential neighborhoods

#20

Post by SECProto »

rland wrote: post #3

When I visited Japan, I went to an izakaya with room for maybe 9 people in it, it was smaller than my living room at home. I was hungry and I saw the sign lighting the alley about 40 yards off the main road. I was thinking at the time, if I lived in that area, you bet I'd be there a couple times a week to talk to my neighbors. I wanted to ask those inside if they were all neighbors, because they seemed to know each o…

Japan uses inclusive zoning, and most urban areas are zoned for high density residential/commercial. The only zoning that is truly exclusive is industrial
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