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Pothead Ph.D. - This is most definitely not a cautionary tale

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Re: Pothead Ph.D. - This is most definitely not a cautionary tale

#81
post #68
post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

By some estimates, marijuana is the largest cash crop in the US. It's very much a local industry. (You probably don't have people in your neighborhood growing tobacco, but you almost certainly have people growing marijuana.) http://abcnews.go.com/Business/story?id=2735017&page=1

Perhaps I should clarify then? Tobacco farmers goes back generations and make up a significant part of the traditional economy. They are taxed heavily and contribute a lot to the local and national economies. In general, marijuana farming goes back about generation, is not taxed (for obvious reasons) and very few people who grow marijuana really on it for there sole income. Enough of it is imported so that it is not…

Fixed the link.

Marijuana has a long history too. If it were legalized, the industry would be taxed just like tobacco. If tobacco was outlawed there would be underground tobacco farmers just like we have today with weed.

It's silly to say tobacco is good because the farmers are good people who had parents who did the same thing. Their crop kills thousands of people. Weed kills no one. I'm for legalization of both, but by the numbers tobacco is the one we should be worried about.

Re: Pothead Ph.D. - This is most definitely not a cautionary tale

#82
post #81
post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Perhaps I should clarify then? Tobacco farmers goes back generations and make up a significant part of the traditional economy. They are taxed heavily and contribute a lot to the local and national economies. In general, marijuana farming goes back about generation, is not taxed (for obvious reasons) and very few people who grow marijuana really on it for there sole income. Enough of it is imported so that it is not…

Fixed the link. Marijuana has a long history too. If it were legalized, the industry would be taxed just like tobacco. If tobacco was outlawed there would be underground tobacco farmers just like we have today with weed. It's silly to say tobacco is good because the farmers are good people who had parents who did the same thing. Their crop kills thousands of people. Weed kills no one. I'm for legalization of both, bu…

It's silly to say tobacco is good because the farmers are good people who had parents who did the same thing.

That's good, because I didn't say that. I said that it's legal because tobacco farmers are a more established part of the economy; that it's legal for historical reasons.

Marijuana has a long history too. If it were legalized, the industry would be taxed just like tobacco.

If Marijuana were allowed to establish itself as an open industry, sure. But it hasn't, or rather, it hadn't at the time of the first drug laws against it. Which is the whole point. I don't know why you're having trouble with this.

Their crop kills thousands of people. Weed kills no one.

BS, smoking weed has the exact same effects on your health as smoking tobacco and plenty of people have died smoking weed.In terms of danger they are around the same. The difference in numbers has more to do with relative popularity and the openness people have with their habits.

Re: Pothead Ph.D. - This is most definitely not a cautionary tale

#83
post #11

Oh you poor baby! You have trouble reading and writing and 'rithmetic, so you need a little chemical help. You pussy. Get out of cocoon, er I mean school, get a real job, get married. have a couple of kids, get a mortgage and a couple of car payments, raise those kids without worrying too much about the evils around them, visit Mom in her nursing home, do things for others in need, and, if you have time, have a nice…

You've established yourself here as valuable community member. But this sounds to me like the textbook definition of "kneejerk reaction."

You could make a (calm!) argument that the author has chosen a poor coping method, but this? No, this comment of yours says a lot more about you than it does about the article.

Re: Pothead Ph.D. - This is most definitely not a cautionary tale

#84
post #3

"For that matter, it ain't alcohol, which is far worse for one's body and mind." Except for that not only is moderate consumption of alcohol good for you, but teetotalism is as bad for your health as being morbidly obese. How is it possible for someone to get a Ph.D. without picking up even a trace of scientific literacy?

What about for alcoholics? If refraining from something completely is bad, should we all experience LSD/Cocaine/Heroine infrequently? I would think the real damage of teetotalism would be the stress involved in constantly thinking about and addressing it. Not so much the lack of the substance in the body.

If you define alcoholics as the set of people who, for whatever reason* , tend to drink to excess, that is, who as a rule do not drink moderately, then these health benefits are irrelevant to them. For example, if they try to drink moderately, but only succeed half the time and otherwise seriously overdo it, then the net effect on health is likely to be very negative.

* The debate whether alcoholism is a disease, a personality trait, or something else entirely is irrelevant here.

The health benefits of alcohol are an unusual case, also -- many of its benefits are related to other chemicals that frequently accompany it, such as polyphenols in red wine. This does not apply to "LSD/Cocaine/Heroine" (sic), though there are comparable benefits for coffee and tea (particularly green tea), mostly antioxidants.

Many doctors are reluctant to recommend moderate drinking for its health benefits because it is also addictive and impairs judgment, and in cases where people drink excessively, the health costs are severe. This doesn't apply to most things recommended for health (exercise, eating fruits and vegetables, getting enough sleep, nethack, green tea, pomegranate juice (or whatever the health craze of the moment is, ac,ai berries? peach fuzz?)), because most of those are less likely to be taken to excess, and would probably be several orders of magnitude less harmful even if they were.

Re: Pothead Ph.D. - This is most definitely not a cautionary tale

#85
post #34

Marijuana actually impairs memory and learning http://www.newscientist.com/article.ns?id=dn10607

All Marijuana studies actually funded in the US (they are rare and typically have 1 result) should be cautiously taken into account with the knowledge that our administration does whatever it can to spread FUD to the public about the drug. Follow the money trail ...

[deleted]

Re: Pothead Ph.D. - This is most definitely not a cautionary tale

#86
post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the US the consequences will vary depending on what state you live in. In upstate NY, sitting in traffic court for an evening I learned that every single case for 'possession' (all small amounts - not 'intent to distribute') was given a $50 fine and nothing on their record. What would the 20's have been if everyone was too scared to go to a speakeasy?

The actual NY state law as explained by NORML: "Possession of 25 grams or less of marijuana is punishable by a fine of $100 for the first offense." 25g is .88 ounces, which is what a recreational smoker might consume in an entire year. It's worth noting though that the punishments are much harsher if you get caught smoking or displaying weed in public.

.88 oz lasts about 3 weeks, depending on the quality.

I know, cause, um, a friend told me.

Re: Pothead Ph.D. - This is most definitely not a cautionary tale

#87

Before anyone starts taking this guy seriously, consider the impact that drug use could have on your life in terms of the social effects rather than the drug itself. Being arrested for possession (or, worse, dealing) could invalidate you from easy worldwide travel (merely having been arrested - let alone charged - invalidates you from many visa waiver programs), numerous professions, and delay certain opportunities.…

BTW, most use of marijuana is not for fun, but for intellectual or sensual stimulation, or religious/spiritual reasons, or for medical reasons. You are unfairly marginalizing and minimizing an experience you don't understand if you write all pot use off as fun. Also, consider the positive effects drugs have had in the lives of people like Carl Sagan, Steve Jobs, and Paul Erdos. If you are weighing the future, you should consider the opportunity costs of denying yourself access to the states of consciousness many visionaries bring their insights back from, as well as the negative.

I'm against letting the blind fear of irrational authorities stop people from meeting their human needs. Getting high is a human drive like sleep or sex. Do you think gay people should not have sex in places where it's illegal?

Would you say Turing shouldn't have had sex? Because he was ruining his future for the sake of some temporary fun that actually represented getting a psychological need met?

Re: Pothead Ph.D. - This is most definitely not a cautionary tale

#88
post #11

Oh you poor baby! You have trouble reading and writing and 'rithmetic, so you need a little chemical help. You pussy. Get out of cocoon, er I mean school, get a real job, get married. have a couple of kids, get a mortgage and a couple of car payments, raise those kids without worrying too much about the evils around them, visit Mom in her nursing home, do things for others in need, and, if you have time, have a nice…

You've established yourself here as valuable community member. But this sounds to me like the textbook definition of "kneejerk reaction." You could make a (calm!) argument that the author has chosen a poor coping method, but this? No, this comment of yours says a lot more about you than it does about the article.

You've established yourself here as valuable community member.

Thank you

But this sounds to me like the textbook definition of "kneejerk reaction."

Actually, it was anything but. I thought long and hard about my post and was curious what kind of reaction it would elicit. I guess I found out.

You could make a (calm!) argument that the author has chosen a poor coping method, but this?

I considered that, but obviously didn't. Let me explain...

I love this community. It's my virtual home. That's why I responded like I did.

In order to glean the signal from the noise, we put up with a lot here. Posts like "not hacker news", posts giving advice learned from a book somewhere, submissions about politics and religion, and unnecessary profanity. I have read most of them and usually chuckled and moved on. Not this time.

Lots of people come here, many young and impressionable, looking for all kinds of things. So what is the first thing they saw today? A post from someone who hasn't really accomplished anything important to hackers (as far as I could tell) and who chooses to resort to drugs to get through his day. And then brags about it.

I wanted to make it clear in no uncertain terms that there are people who disagree with him and this post has no business here at hn. I could have said the lame "not hacker news", but that hardly would have gotten my point across.

We are achievers. We work hard and find a way to produce value for other people, often taking the difficult road instead of the easy way out. This guy's post was IMHO the precise opposite of what I believe and what I hope others believe too. Making it through school using drugs is a smack in the face of those of us who work hard in the real world and assemble here to share it.

I simply don't care how anyone wants to live their life. If you want to get high, get drunk, jump out of airplanes, or just sit in front of the TV, go to it.

But if you come into my virtual home, I will respond just like I would in my physical home and say, "Take your drugs and get out."

I wanted to get people's attention. Do you think it worked?

No, this comment of yours says a lot more about you than it does about the article.

What does it say about me that my other 2,873 comments don't?

Re: Pothead Ph.D. - This is most definitely not a cautionary tale

#89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My point is not necessarily the risk of incarceration or the inconvenience of being arrested, but in being able to accept any risk (and clearly there is one, even if it's small) of what problems it might cause in your life if you were to be arrested or have even a minor offense on your file (and considering how deep those files go and how easily they are shared nowadays, that could be a big issue). For example, the U…

This is something to consider. It is relatively easy to avoid being busted if you're in a relaxed place like the Bay Area. However it is easier to get busted in other places. Unfortunately, if you're poor or not white, you're also more at risk for being busted. Two of my friends are barred entry to Canada because of previous possession charges, and Canada has some of the most relaxed pot laws in the world. Also, if y…

No one should ever travel to Dubai for any reason. You do not have any recourse if they decide to fuck you.

Re: Pothead Ph.D. - This is most definitely not a cautionary tale

#90
post #34

Marijuana actually impairs memory and learning http://www.newscientist.com/article.ns?id=dn10607

Right. We all know that Carl Sagan, as well as most musicians, have horrible memories and suck at learning because drug use fried their brain. Marijuana doesn't impair learning. Stupidity (like this study) impairs learning.

Marijuana modulates the way your short term memory works. It does not impair long term memory or recall. The effects of marijuana on short term memory may contribute to creativity by breaking down cognitive structures and creating a space for new concepts to plug into parts of the dissolving short term memories.

If drugs are so harmful, why are they winning the drug war?

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