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Online classes are not worth cost of full tuition

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Re: Online classes are not worth cost of full tuition

#181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Backpacking doesn't have to mean exotic locales. There may be some bucket list activities that are closer to home, eg: Trans Canada Trail, Appalachian Trail, Pacific Crest Trail, Camino de Santiago, etc.

"Trans Canada Trail"? Can we get into Canada? EDIT: I mean that I thought Canada won't allow entry to people from the US? Is that just a rumor?

No non-essential travel for Americans to Canada.

Re: Online classes are not worth cost of full tuition

#182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Volunteer - unemployment is the worst for decades. There are literally half the population not working right now with nothing to do, its the least useful time to volunteer. (OK maybe I'm wrong)

It's because of this unemployment that food banks have an increased need for volunteers. My local food bank certainly requests volunteers, and they're recommending that seniors or those with health conditions cancel their shifts...further reducing their volunteer pool.

I don't think it's the demand side that is the issue, it's more the supply side. A lot of people don't live a life where they can afford to spend a year volunteering. They need some kind of income. What happens when there are no stimulus checks and no increased access to unemployment? Or will they extend those programs so that they last another 12 months at least?

We have to be cognizant of the fact that, by all indications, October will be a very stressful time for a lot of people.

Re: Online classes are not worth cost of full tuition

#183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Backpacking doesn't have to mean exotic locales. There may be some bucket list activities that are closer to home, eg: Trans Canada Trail, Appalachian Trail, Pacific Crest Trail, Camino de Santiago, etc.

"Trans Canada Trail"? Can we get into Canada? EDIT: I mean that I thought Canada won't allow entry to people from the US? Is that just a rumor?

No it isn't a rumour. There were a bunch of options in different countries. I think they were just listing some so that anyone could choose their local.

Re: Online classes are not worth cost of full tuition

#184
post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can study without paying tens of thousands of dollars. There are also tons of productive uses of time that can be done during the pandemic. Now is a great time to volunteer.

Only you can afford to do something like that or are bankrolled by someone else. I couldn't afford being away from my only source of income at school (student loans) for a year when I was going to school, I would literally be homeless without it. Add on that it's very difficult to get a job to support yourself right now and full time students are not eligible for unemployment. That's not even considering the risks yo…

Don't assume I'm coming from a position of privilege. I dropped out of college because I couldn't pay for it, and if I could go back, I would absolutely not go in debt for those years of college which didn't result in a degree.

Let's be clear here: student loans are not income. If you're going into debt to pay for college, that's even more reason that you should wait to go to college.

If your reason for staying in school this year is that you need funds to survive, you'd be much better off trying to find a job. Jobs pay in actual money, not debt. If you're college age and able-bodied, the delivery companies are all understaffed to the point that if you can fill out an application you're probably hired. It's not glamorous but it's better than many situations right now. When my business was floundering last year, I used my truck to haul recycling for local businesses. Sometimes the best option is not very good.

Obviously you know your situation better than I do, and it may be that there are some other reasons why going to school is a better option. But nothing you have said so far indicates that to me.

Re: Online classes are not worth cost of full tuition

#185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Volunteer - unemployment is the worst for decades. There are literally half the population not working right now with nothing to do, its the least useful time to volunteer. (OK maybe I'm wrong)

You are uninformed. Please delete your post and stop spreading harmful misinformation. 1. Just because people aren't working doesn't mean they are volunteering. In fact, there's an exodus of volunteers, because retirees, the group which historically is most likely to volunteer, are also the most likely to isolate because they're at high risk from coronavirus. This is causing a massive shift in the demographic of volu…

Good point on retirees, I'm sure there are lots of gaps like that out there.

Re: Online classes are not worth cost of full tuition

#186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except "embracing" is definitely not the right word. Very few professors I know are happy about this whole situation. Universities are begrudgingly accepting the fact that they can't have in-person classes, so they have to turn to online alternatives. Tuition can't be changed because the few costs that are being saved (facilities still need maintenance) are offset by the massive losses in revenue from student housing…

It seems like an educational instituion relying on income from real estate properties points to the greater issue here: General lack of funding for education. Making money off housing will disproportionately affect students of differing income backgrounds, so this is not the same as moving that cost to tuition fees. Schools shouldn't have to run themselves like a traditional business, yet that is exactly the model mo…

> Making money off housing will disproportionately affect students of differing income backgrounds

Having trouble parsing this. What do you mean?

IMO the problem is that many colleges are not focused on education to begin with. They compete with each other by building the most luxurious facilities, sports programs, and so forth. Then they pay execs crazy salaries while leaving the actual instructors in the dust:

"Auditors said salaries paid to staff in the UC president’s office are much higher than the pay of comparable positions in other state government jobs. Administrative salaries amounted to a combined $2.5 million more than the maximum annual salaries for comparable state employee positions, auditors found.

For instance, the UC system’s chief investment officer has a base salary of $615,000, while the top investment officer with the state’s teachers’ retirement system is paid $568,000, the audit found."

https://www.latimes.com/politics/la-pol-sac-uc-audit-2017042...

Re: Online classes are not worth cost of full tuition

#187
I see a lot of people saying take a gap year. I'm the father of a daughter who's starting college this fall. Here are some things needing to be considered:

- You've been accepted for this fall. The college is under no obligation to delay your start until next year, especially when there's a fresh batch of incoming students.

- You think it's tough to enroll in classes this fall? Wait until you double the number of students all trying to take the same classes! That should be fun!

- My daughter has 4 different scholarships. They're all predicated on her starting this fall. Take it or lose it. These scholarships are paying over 50% of all her costs. Since she's going to a State University that means I can afford most if not all the rest leaving her with a minimal amount of debt.

- It's her freshman year. I feel more sorry for the juniors and seniors. Most freshman year classes can be done online. The more advanced the class, the more you should be attending in person.

- Silver lining - incoming freshman will have to focus more on scholastics and academics and not partying.

- Her major, pharmaceutical drug research & development, can't be done online. Yes, there are some classes you can do online, and most of those are in the freshman year, but ultimately you have to have in-person instruction. Especially for the labs.

- Her school isn't in one of the "hot spots" and has a governor and mayor more-or-less enforcing mask laws. The dorm housing density has been decreased by 50% - which has left some of the students scrambling to find off-campus housing. All the incoming freshman are guaranteed housing.

- She got her dorm assignment yesterday and the steps the university is taking to keep students safe. Daily temperature checks, contact tracing, mix of in-person and virtual classes, on-campus COVID testing with 6 hour test result turn around time, quarantine dorms, dining halls are delivery only. I should mention this university has one of the best research hospitals in the country and a huge medical complex serving the public.

Finally, ask yourself this: why do you think anything is going to be any better 1 year from now? Almost every other country in the world is getting back to normal but the United States has done very little in the past 7 months and so far there's no indication that's changing anytime soon. There's no reason to believe things are going to substantially improve by this time next year unless we start taking the steps to make that so. Even a vaccine may not help as the early estimates for the cost of a vaccine is $1,000 per dose. Health insurers aren't going to want to pay that kind of money for everybody. Will the U.S. government? We blew through $7 trillion this year with very little to show for it so who knows?

Re: Online classes are not worth cost of full tuition

#188
post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We are definitely at a disadvantage in terms of having robust technical discussions before implementing new features at my work. Something that previously would be discussed by the whole team is now either just implemented solo or discussed between one or two other people before moving forward. One of the big issues we've had, which I think we're getting better at, is not realizing how much others on the team are in…

I think what you are expressing a difficult time with is more of an effect from the uncertainty and operating under a state of what was supposed to be a short term emergency measure to "flatten the curve". Unfortunately I think that it is also a symptom of poor adaptation to the supposed pandemic, just as much as it is uncertainty for how long this will go on that keeps people and organizations from rebuilding and re…

I absolutely agree. Thanks for your comment.

Re: Online classes are not worth cost of full tuition

#189
post #18

I did an online MS at Georgia Tech. I paid full price tuition for the program. Literally 3 years after I graduated, they announced a slash in price by 80 (EIGHTY!) percent. The program was excellent, and if not for my company offering to pay for it I wouldn't have considered it. I can absolutely recommend it now that it's so much cheaper, but it was also designed to be a remote program from the start.

OMSA/OMSCS worth it? I don’t want a résumé item that may be considered watered down in the future. Plus, with more self-study, can’t you can get into most tech companies because they tend to be more open?

Mine was in information security (undergrad was CS). It was generally my experience that it didn't weigh much in the minds of hiring managers, at least not as much as real world experience. It does however seem to buy you a higher initial slotting/pay band than you would otherwise have if you were given an offer. I did learn quite a bit of useful things, qualitatively, which I can most definitely apply to my work. In my experience certs and experience tend to weigh more heavily for job accessibility.

Re: Online classes are not worth cost of full tuition

#190
post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem with gap years is you loose an additional year of income at the college graduate level on the backend, that's a pretty big missed financial opportunity. With the economy in the state it's in now, it's unlikely most college students will be able to land decent paying jobs during a gap year, if they can find a job at all. Better to just finish the degree as quickly as possible and be ready to enter the work…

>The problem with gap years is you loose an additional year of income at the college graduate level on the backend, that's a pretty big missed financial opportunity. I don't really disagree with your other points (though I might make a different decision). But I'm not sure I buy the argument that you should enter the workforce as young as you can profitably do so (considering net present value relative to educational…

The average 18 year old just starting college doesn't have a job or has a low paying hourly job, has no savings and is still very much dependent on their parents for at least some financial support. For many parents delaying the time their children enter the work force can represent a significant financial burden. I am all for saving up and taking time off between jobs, sabbaticals, extended vacations and traveling the world, but doing it on mommy and daddy's dime is a fairly selfish pursuit.
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