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The Billionaire Behind Efforts to Kill the U.S. Postal Service [pdf]

inthepublicinterest.org

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Re: The Billionaire Behind Efforts to Kill the U.S. Postal Service [pdf]

#41

Post by trothamel »

abruzzi wrote: post #16
_emacsomancer_ wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All of the other major delivery services in the US (UPS, FedEx, DHL, Ontrac) are horrible and far worse than the USPS. And without the USPS to compete against, they'd be even worse.

And the bigger deal (to me) is that none of the competitors are really competitors in the key area of the USPS--first class mail delivery. Can UPS, FedEX deliver a letter (or a bill, or check, or...) for $0.55?

Given that they're forbidden by law from doing so (without first paying the postage to the USPS), no.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Private_Express_Statutes

Re: The Billionaire Behind Efforts to Kill the U.S. Postal Service [pdf]

#42

Post by tdeck »

ed25519FUUU wrote: post #22
InTheArena wrote: post #13

The USPS's primary revenue source is as a Spam delivery service. That basic problem is why it has refused to modernize. Anything with any significant value is already sent via Amazon, FedEx, DHL or UPS, or hand-delivered (in the case of really valuable stuff). See: https://www.insidesources.com/outbox-vs-usps-how-the-post-of... The USPS has to be reformed and it needs a new purpose in life, other then stable governme…

Having a last-mile delivery method available for every corner of the continental USA is enough of a raison d'être. That's value for the country. Advertising is a money maker and it subsidizes the other business. I don't really see a problem with this.

Not only is it valuable to private citizens, but FedEx and UPS use the postal service for last mile delivery as well. For example here's FedEx:

https://www.fedex.com/en-us/shipping/fedex-smartpost/network...

Re: The Billionaire Behind Efforts to Kill the U.S. Postal Service [pdf]

#43

Post by DevKoala »

toiletfuneral wrote: post #28
InTheArena wrote: post #13

The USPS's primary revenue source is as a Spam delivery service. That basic problem is why it has refused to modernize. Anything with any significant value is already sent via Amazon, FedEx, DHL or UPS, or hand-delivered (in the case of really valuable stuff). See: https://www.insidesources.com/outbox-vs-usps-how-the-post-of... The USPS has to be reformed and it needs a new purpose in life, other then stable governme…

why should basic government services be profitable?

Like the parent mentioned, the service is exploited by companies to do their cheap spam advertising. Is it okay for taxes to cover this?

Re: The Billionaire Behind Efforts to Kill the U.S. Postal Service [pdf]

#44

Post by bmitc »

darawk wrote: post #26
bmitc wrote: post #20

The amount of narcissism these people (the Koch's, for example) have is just astounding. If you're a billionaire, what could possibly be a reasonable explanation for why you even care about the post office? Why are these people so hell bent on hurting people to feed their own narcissism? The USPS could be improved but struggles primarily due to active efforts to kill it off. But it's a wonderful idea of a service tha…

It's ideological. They believe that the government should not be in the postal business. They probably believe that it's harmful to competition in various ways, and they are probably right in certain narrow contexts.

The same argument of being harmful to competition could be extended to schools and libraries and . It's just mind blowing why we should care about companies more than people. So what if it's harmful to competition? What merit does that have? (These aren't questions for you. They're rhetorical.)

Re: The Billionaire Behind Efforts to Kill the U.S. Postal Service [pdf]

#45

Post by jschwartzi »

ralph84 wrote: post #29
enraged_camel wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The USPS offers a unique combination of affordability and reliability that simply cannot be matched by the private sector. Yes, it is subsidized. The reason is that being able to send and receive mail cheaply and reliably is the cornerstone of our society and our economic system.

I guess maybe you haven't enabled electronic statements for your accounts or something, but for me 99% of what I get from USPS is junk mail or online shopping deliveries. Not clear why either of those need to be subsidized.

They're not subsidized. USPS is required by law to pay its own way. This is a common misconception about USPS that is simply not true.

When people talk about International Mail being "subsidized" they're talking about EG treaty negotiations with China that force the USPS to receive international packages from China at significantly below cost. They then have to pass those costs onto the US consumer.

Re: The Billionaire Behind Efforts to Kill the U.S. Postal Service [pdf]

#46

Post by KeepFlying »

ed25519FUUU wrote: post #22
InTheArena wrote: post #13

The USPS's primary revenue source is as a Spam delivery service. That basic problem is why it has refused to modernize. Anything with any significant value is already sent via Amazon, FedEx, DHL or UPS, or hand-delivered (in the case of really valuable stuff). See: https://www.insidesources.com/outbox-vs-usps-how-the-post-of... The USPS has to be reformed and it needs a new purpose in life, other then stable governme…

Having a last-mile delivery method available for every corner of the continental USA is enough of a raison d'être. That's value for the country. Advertising is a money maker and it subsidizes the other business. I don't really see a problem with this.

You have hit on the EXACT reason that the USPS is so critical. There are huge areas of the US which are not serviced by other private delivery services. And even in areas where those services do reach, I imagine the cost is extremely high.

People in Barrow, Alaska deserve access to mailing services as much as people in NYC. Without that, there is no reliable way to contact everyone in the US for the purpose of the Census, Voting (where mail-in voting is available), Jury Duty notifications, Selective Service, etc.

There are critical government services that still must be run over "snail mail" and to pass that off to a private institution which will not be able to service all areas equally will lead to more inequality.

Re: The Billionaire Behind Efforts to Kill the U.S. Postal Service [pdf]

#47

Post by harryh »

alexbanks wrote: post #24
InTheArena wrote: post #13

The USPS's primary revenue source is as a Spam delivery service. That basic problem is why it has refused to modernize. Anything with any significant value is already sent via Amazon, FedEx, DHL or UPS, or hand-delivered (in the case of really valuable stuff). See: https://www.insidesources.com/outbox-vs-usps-how-the-post-of... The USPS has to be reformed and it needs a new purpose in life, other then stable governme…

How do I do mail in voting via Amazon, FedEx, DHL?

You can FedEx an absentee ballot. There is no requirement to use USPS.

Re: The Billionaire Behind Efforts to Kill the U.S. Postal Service [pdf]

#48

Post by acdha »

InTheArena wrote: post #13

The USPS's primary revenue source is as a Spam delivery service. That basic problem is why it has refused to modernize. Anything with any significant value is already sent via Amazon, FedEx, DHL or UPS, or hand-delivered (in the case of really valuable stuff). See: https://www.insidesources.com/outbox-vs-usps-how-the-post-of... The USPS has to be reformed and it needs a new purpose in life, other then stable governme…

The major problem the USPS has is the 2006 law requiring them to prefund employee pensions at the time of retirement, which no other business has to do. Changing that to normal accounting alone would substantially transform their finances.

A secondary problem is that Congress will interfere with decisions to reduce service in unprofitable areas but not officially subsidize it. This makes the post office appear to be unprofitable because we see the cost of having service in rural areas but don’t directly record the costs to the people who live there and the business which otherwise would not happen without that service.

Re: The Billionaire Behind Efforts to Kill the U.S. Postal Service [pdf]

#49

Post by treis »

qntty wrote: post #34
InTheArena wrote: post #13

The USPS's primary revenue source is as a Spam delivery service. That basic problem is why it has refused to modernize. Anything with any significant value is already sent via Amazon, FedEx, DHL or UPS, or hand-delivered (in the case of really valuable stuff). See: https://www.insidesources.com/outbox-vs-usps-how-the-post-of... The USPS has to be reformed and it needs a new purpose in life, other then stable governme…

On the other hand, privatized delivery poses the same problem as private control of the internet in the absence of net neutrality. If there was no USPS to compete with, what's the stop Amazon and other major retailers from coming to agreements with delivery companies to charge higher fees for "non-partner" deliveries.

The Sherman anti-trust act

Re: The Billionaire Behind Efforts to Kill the U.S. Postal Service [pdf]

#50

Post by paulgb »

InTheArena wrote: post #13

The USPS's primary revenue source is as a Spam delivery service. That basic problem is why it has refused to modernize. Anything with any significant value is already sent via Amazon, FedEx, DHL or UPS, or hand-delivered (in the case of really valuable stuff). See: https://www.insidesources.com/outbox-vs-usps-how-the-post-of... The USPS has to be reformed and it needs a new purpose in life, other then stable governme…

From that article, it's not clear what USPS is getting the blame for here. Reading between the lines, it sounds like a startup asked them to reroute their customers' mail to them, and USPS said "no we don't do that"?

They ultimately found a way around it but shut down due to lack of sign-ups[1], so it seems like USPS saved themselves some time.

[1] https://techcrunch.com/2014/01/21/outbox-shuts-down/

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