I remember being very concerned that the fact checkers wouldn't be operating in a vacuum and we'd have a bunch of facebook execs being arbiters of truth. And that appears to be exactly what has happened. This is terrifying. A handful of mainstream publications and a bunch of basically unknown facebook folks are now the censors. We've already seen well known EFF activists rated untrue for their arguments against warra…
Let us be honest here. The people that have the job to sort out this stuff might also not be the brightest stars in the night sky. If I had vested interests where manipulation of social media nets me advantages, I would be very content with the situation.
Facebook overrides fact-checks when climate science is “opinion”
31–40 of 259 posts
Re: Facebook overrides fact-checks when climate science is “opinion”
#32Earlier quoted context omitted.
Facebook is the 6th most popular website on the planet (behind Google, Youtube, and 3 Chinese sites). That puts them in a position of control over a great deal of the world's information diet. If they say something is false or true, many people will believe it. If they censor something, many people will never see it.
How does that put them in control? Users still read at least five other websites. Their popularity does not give them any ability to censor information widely, unless perhaps they collude with search engines to blacklist certain terms across all popular sites. The fact that many people use Facebook is an indicator that those same huge groups also have access to every other website , which reduces the persuasiveness o…
Three of those are entirely Chinese and can be discounted from this conversation due to government. That leaves two sites run by the same company, all of which are headquartered in the same general area and have similar culture, and both have ongoing censorship/misinformation controversies.
Re: Facebook overrides fact-checks when climate science is “opinion”
#33The oldest of newspapers struggle with these kinds of judgements (until they just decide to stop caring and cater to a certain political side).
It is not reasonable to expect Facebook to get it right with any consistency, if there even is a definitive correct answer to begin with.
Re: Facebook overrides fact-checks when climate science is “opinion”
#34Question: facebook as a platform is not liable for information it contains. However if Facebook would publish fact checking info, that is wrong or missleading, are they liable? Could I sue facebook if their "facts" were proven wrong, and cause me damage?
Per the landmark ruling NYTimes v Sullivan — no, you'd probably lose that case.
Re: Facebook overrides fact-checks when climate science is “opinion”
#35Earlier quoted context omitted.
How is Facebook the arbiter of truth when many, many websites other than Facebook exist, and most human beings do not use Facebook? This is a very different scenario than a single company owning every broadcast tower in a town, pre-internet. The ability to access Facebook strongly implies general internet access , which is a compelling argument against Facebook exerting any sort of authority over general truth.
Facebook is the 6th most popular website on the planet (behind Google, Youtube, and 3 Chinese sites). That puts them in a position of control over a great deal of the world's information diet. If they say something is false or true, many people will believe it. If they censor something, many people will never see it.
Re: Facebook overrides fact-checks when climate science is “opinion”
#36Re: Facebook overrides fact-checks when climate science is “opinion”
#37I remember being very concerned that the fact checkers wouldn't be operating in a vacuum and we'd have a bunch of facebook execs being arbiters of truth. And that appears to be exactly what has happened. This is terrifying. A handful of mainstream publications and a bunch of basically unknown facebook folks are now the censors. We've already seen well known EFF activists rated untrue for their arguments against warra…
Re: Facebook overrides fact-checks when climate science is “opinion”
#38Earlier quoted context omitted.
How does that put them in control? Users still read at least five other websites. Their popularity does not give them any ability to censor information widely, unless perhaps they collude with search engines to blacklist certain terms across all popular sites. The fact that many people use Facebook is an indicator that those same huge groups also have access to every other website , which reduces the persuasiveness o…
>Users still read at least five other websites. Three of those are entirely Chinese and can be discounted from this conversation due to government. That leaves two sites run by the same company, all of which are headquartered in the same general area and have similar culture, and both have ongoing censorship/misinformation controversies.
Re: Facebook overrides fact-checks when climate science is “opinion”
#39Firstly, this article is about American issues, so it’s only the America issue “lens” that is being used to focus on issues. These same and similar issues must exist for every other country, many of whom have 0 ability to fund and afford individuals who can dedicate their time and lives to fact checking their Local power structures or narratives.
Secondly, even the constrained solution/issue space is too deep for Facebook to effectively police - leaving aside the philosophical arguments.
Removing statements which say “all minority people need to die” is easy,
Removing opinion pieces ? Suppose Kanye says he doesn’t believe in vaccines and that is his opinion. Remove ? Keep?
Is it noteworthy because a huge personality said it ? What about people who are B list celebrities. Or C list ?
What about an article which says “we find that the science on climate change makes claims that are not supported entirely by the data, here is why and here is research.” -
Now you need specialistS or have access to a network of diagnosticians who can tell you whether complex pieces of content are Trojans or not.
Facebook and social media enterprises are paying the price of the hollowing out of editorial boards. All those local newspapers and newsrooms where stuff gets filtered - that is the likely amount of (Skilled) manpower Facebook needs to employ to handle this.
This is where the social media model totally collapses - you can have issues with climate denial, fake medicine, voter suppression etc. - and sub divisions of these problem.
There’s never a shortage of problems and a fractal level of complexity.
How do you ever satisfy the verification needs at this point?
Therefore social networks will always have massive numbers of bad actors, subterranean cults, hidden mind viruses infecting armies of people, propaganda and legions of victims.
This isn’t an idle question - the problems here are about the nature of how humans structure Their networks, verify information and build trust.
Facebook or any social network will always fail at this, unless they see this as what it really is - time to make editorial decisions on content on the network at scale.
The Silicon Valley hey day ideal of free speech is dead. We’re now in a rear guard action to ring fence people from infectious and malicious ideas.
If you think this is a step too far, please remember that America has people actively fighting wearing face masks during the greatest modern Pandemic.
Re: Facebook overrides fact-checks when climate science is “opinion”
#40I remember being very concerned that the fact checkers wouldn't be operating in a vacuum and we'd have a bunch of facebook execs being arbiters of truth. And that appears to be exactly what has happened. This is terrifying. A handful of mainstream publications and a bunch of basically unknown facebook folks are now the censors. We've already seen well known EFF activists rated untrue for their arguments against warra…