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Peter Thiel on Progress and Stagnation

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Re: Peter Thiel on Progress and Stagnation

#161
post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The doc itself was only put together recently, but it's composed of quotes and interviews from over the last decade.

Seems like he's stagnated.

as an obsessive observer of his over the past decade, I've been concerned... It could be a product of his increased concern over public media coverage in general (he keeps his really interesting views just to himself, as Nick Cammarata mentions on Twitter), and this trend may have only intensified recently, as he has been strangely quiet

Re: Peter Thiel on Progress and Stagnation

#162
post #72

I disagree with Thiel on almost every page on this document. And I don't know which topic to really critise. Like his view on regulation, which he calls a burden. I don't want to live in a world w/o regulations, I want to know what is in my food, I want to know that the devices I use are safe. We could see what happens, when regulation fails, when two 737MAX crashed due to the fact that Boeing was able to hide MCAS f…

> At one point Thiel is quoted with "The public transportation systems don’t work." Which is a bold and false statement, because public transportation can work extremely well.

I mean, it doesn’t work for him, since he doesn’t need it..

As someone without a car or even a license, who relies on public transport (albeit in Europe), I think this highlights the issues I have with economic inequality... Interests diverging until they become opposed.

(Just to be clear, I agree that Peter Thiel’s claims with regards to public transport is false in general)

Re: Peter Thiel on Progress and Stagnation

#163
post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

FAAMG is like 20% of the GDP of the USA, the state can't intervene with itself

Where did you get that idea? FAANG companies are valued at ~5 trillion USD (rough estimate). The US's GDP is 20 trillion USD. But the GDP is measured annually! The US has a GDP that's 4 times the value of the FAANG companies every year.

Thanks, I just found this better stat: "The “FAAMG” basket accounts for 18% of the total S&P 500 value"

Re: Peter Thiel on Progress and Stagnation

#165
I highly recommend the website https://wtfhappenedin1971.com/ and in particular their excellent newsletter. Surely, it would be an oversimplification to reduce everything to one cause but how much the setup of the original gold standard of the bank of England in the late 1770s spurred on the industrial revolution and how the centralization of gold and the final abolishing of the gold standard and ensuing financial tinkering led to malinvestments and threw wrenches into the engine of capitalism, wealth generation and ever increasing living standards has IMHO not yet sufficiently been investigated (Prof. Saifedean Ammous work here being one laudable exception). In an interview from 2019 Peter Thiel mentions that Paypal would have never succeeded had the Patriot Act existed at the time. Banking regulations would have never allowed Paypal off the ground. Just a few years between Paypal and that monstrocity: We would not have Tesla. We wouldnt have SpaceX. There wouldn't be any Boring company or any Neuralink. The opportunity cost of all of that is unfathomable.

Re: Peter Thiel on Progress and Stagnation

#166
post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wait, despite the perfect timing for a real cause that page is really trying to attribute it to monetary policy?

That is their take, but you gotta admit, something happened in the early 1970s.

They use the exact year of the oil crisis on their title. There was nothing financial about that one, it's entirely on the real part of the economy.

Yes, something happened on the early 70's. But that article is a biased gathering of disconnected evidence surrounded by a story that was set independently of any of that evidence and doesn't even make sense. It is still useful to point people to the problem, but it would be incredibly more useful if there were an actually good source we could use.

Re: Peter Thiel on Progress and Stagnation

#167
"The easiest way to see this, and this is always my challenge—people don’t agree with this—is challenge you to name me one science fiction film that Hollywood produced in the last 25 years in which technology is portrayed in a positive light, in which it’s not dystopian, it doesn’t kill people, it doesn’t destroy the world, it doesn’t not work, etc., etc."

Interstellar?

Re: Peter Thiel on Progress and Stagnation

#168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seems like he's stagnated.

as an obsessive observer of his over the past decade, I've been concerned... It could be a product of his increased concern over public media coverage in general (he keeps his really interesting views just to himself, as Nick Cammarata mentions on Twitter), and this trend may have only intensified recently, as he has been strangely quiet

The IPO has likely been taking up a lot of time. Also, there is a blackout period before most IPOs where those in the company are not allowed to talk about the company or 'sell' it. The SEC guidelines are pretty strict and jeopardizing XYZ% of the IPO can result in millions on the gambling table.

Re: Peter Thiel on Progress and Stagnation

#169
post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’d like to be given the option to. Why should you prevent me a free adult from doing it?

What choice would you have? If there were no regulations, businesses could lie on packaging. You wouldn’t have the information to make informed choices.

There's a distinction here between law and regulation.

Even hard core libertarians don't think there should be no laws. That's a straw man. They tend to believe governments should vigorously enforce contracts, trademarks, punish fraud and provide other tools that make commerce easy. In other words that they give people the tools to keep each other honest, but don't try to directly mandate every detail of every product.

The word law tends to mean these general, timeless rules that often date back a long way. They don't create ossification or stagnation (Thiel's primary concern) because they don't advantage any particular way of doing things, just enforce fair dealing and honesty.

The word regulation tends to be used to mean rather modern and very sector-specific rules, which frequently ossify existing practice and prevent people trying anything new. Often they are nakedly about doing exactly that - taxi medallions are one such form of regulation.

The people who support such regulations invariably claim they're about safety or preventing some sort of harm. The evidence for this is highly mixed. It often relies on an absurd, cartoon-character view of companies in which they'll happily kill all their customers to make a quick buck with no concern for long term consequences whatsoever, if the noble and morally pure government employee doesn't step in to stop them.

But there are plenty of cases where regulations seem to have created more harm than good, and vastly more where it's ambiguous. Do we really need governments to regulate the taxi industry, for example? Arguably not. It seems Uber is widely judged as being a better taxi regulator than the government, as it can use far faster and more plentiful feedback vs the paper or faxed complaint forms governments typically provide.

Libertarians often make arguments of this form - that the alternative to government regulations is not some anarchist wild west in which people go mad murdering each other with explosive contraptions. The alternative is private sector regulation of various kinds, in which logos and trademarks are used to establish meaning behind a mark and consumers gravitate to products that have those marks, as they're understood to be a sign of quality and safety. The advantage being that if that organisation succumbs to various kinds of dysfunction, like capture, or stagnation, then another can come along and outcompete it. Whereas with government regulators that can't happen - you can get endless decades or even centuries of unfixable dysfunction.

Re: Peter Thiel on Progress and Stagnation

#170
post #72

I disagree with Thiel on almost every page on this document. And I don't know which topic to really critise. Like his view on regulation, which he calls a burden. I don't want to live in a world w/o regulations, I want to know what is in my food, I want to know that the devices I use are safe. We could see what happens, when regulation fails, when two 737MAX crashed due to the fact that Boeing was able to hide MCAS f…

> At one point Thiel is quoted with "The public transportation systems don’t work." Which is a bold and false statement, because public transportation can work extremely well. I mean, it doesn’t work for him, since he doesn’t need it.. As someone without a car or even a license, who relies on public transport (albeit in Europe), I think this highlights the issues I have with economic inequality... Interests diverging…

A lot of what Thiel writes is from a US centric viewpoint, which is fine, he's an American living in America. And in the biggest US cities public transport doesn't work all that well.
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