Oregon, Journalists Sue U.S. over Portland Arrests, Violence • Hacker News Board

Re: Oregon, Journalists Sue U.S. over Portland Arrests, Violence

#71

Post by Kednicma » Sat, Jul 18, 2020, 6:17 PM UTC

jtgi8jgfdg wrote: post #53

staycoolboy wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And a garbage can was set on fire. And one or two windows smashed. But to hear it from Fox news, they think its the LA riots from '92.

Watch videos on Andy Ngo's Twitter feed. The Portland protesters are engaged in much more violent activities than setting a garbage can on fire.

Hop on a bus and go across the river; go downtown. Neighborhoods which are on the western "downtown" side of the river, but north of Burnside, are fine. Drive up MLK and you'll see nothing out of the ordinary.

If you are looking at our city only through the lens of some biased cameraperson, then you are getting a limited view. Go outside.

Indeed, go to a park! Only the two parks across from the downtown courthouse are closed.

Edit: Downvoters, go outside and look at Portland. Or, if you don't live in Portland, consider carefully why you think that firsthand observations are worth discounting.

Re: Oregon, Journalists Sue U.S. over Portland Arrests, Violence

#72

Post by tantalor » Sat, Jul 18, 2020, 6:17 PM UTC

mfer wrote: post #59

I'm left with a lot of questions like... When someone is arrested there are certain legal requirements, like the miranda warning, that must be done. Are those all being followed? People need to be charged in the proper jurisdiction for the proper laws. Is that happening? A person can only be held in custody for a limited period of time without charges being filed. Is this being followed? Are the details documented an…

> certain legal requirements, like the miranda warning

No. Many people believe that if they are arrested and not "read their rights," they can escape punishment. Not true. But if the police fail to read a suspect his or her Miranda rights, the prosecutor can't use for most purposes anything the suspect says as evidence against the suspect at trial.

https://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/police-questioning-m...

Re: Oregon, Journalists Sue U.S. over Portland Arrests, Violence

#73

Post by [deleted] » Sat, Jul 18, 2020, 6:19 PM UTC

jmpman wrote: post #64

R0b0t1 wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is more evidence to add to the pile pro-2nd people have to never compromise. The last really bad one was police taking guns from people during Katrina. This is probably far worse. There's no way it is legal, and if it somehow is, it is more evidence of how badly out of touch with reality most judges are.

Maybe both sides should be pro 2nd amendment. And pro 1st amendment, and 3rd, 4th, 5th....

[deleted]

Re: Oregon, Journalists Sue U.S. over Portland Arrests, Violence

#74

Post by throwaway_USD » Sat, Jul 18, 2020, 6:19 PM UTC

krapp wrote: post #29

pravus wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We were told to shut up and put away our guns because these things could never happen...

But you didn't. You replied to those people that they could pry your guns from your cold, dead hands and they would be the first against the wall when the revolution came. You told us you and your guns were the only things keeping the only free state in existence truly free. You waxed poetic about watering the tree of liberty with the blood of tyrants. You called anyone who believed in any form of gun control a cowar…

Maybe its not just so much about "allowing" these acts because they are happening to "the other side", but just like most people who talk a big game when push came to shove they found themselves shitting their pants and realizing their worst fears about the government came true and their worst fears about themselves that they are all talk and it was easy to scream give me freedom or give me death until the armed government came for their freedom.

Re: Oregon, Journalists Sue U.S. over Portland Arrests, Violence

#75

Post by eanzenberg » Sat, Jul 18, 2020, 6:19 PM UTC

Antifa was declared a terrorist organization. They were seen as co-opting a movement, instigating with violence throughout the country, especially in poor neighborhoods, and attempting to start a race-war. However you may feel about the designation, the means to stop them are deemed serious enough to warrant these measures.

Re: Oregon, Journalists Sue U.S. over Portland Arrests, Violence

#76

Post by Google234 » Sat, Jul 18, 2020, 6:20 PM UTC

LurkersWillLurk wrote: post #62

whatthesmack wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My thoughts exactly. When they’re being violent and destroying things, does it really come as a surprise that they’re getting arrested?

This isn't about whether or not they get arrested. This is about certain ground rules and principles that the government must always uphold, even against unprincipled opponents. Federal law enforcement officers, dressed in camo gear and without any identifying insignia, arresting and covering the faces of alleged rioters and stuffing them into unmarked vehicles and taking them God-knows-where is absolutely unacceptab…

I have a feel we know where the rioters are being taken after being arrested. This has been going on for more than a month.

Re: Oregon, Journalists Sue U.S. over Portland Arrests, Violence

#77

Post by itsoktocry » Sat, Jul 18, 2020, 6:21 PM UTC

jorblumesea wrote: post #49

itsoktocry wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Where are the "second amendments against tyranny folks"? Not supporting the people who blame them for violence and want to take their guns away. Does that surprise you? Perhaps there is a lesson here somewhere.

I think my point was that it was entirely a bad faith argument. They never cared about preserving freedoms, American democracy or the values that this country stands for. It was just a political tool in a cultural war chess game. It was to drive gun sales and get people out to vote. They talk about having these guns to stand up to government overreach, preserving liberty and freedoms etc. Then when we have literal se…

>They never cared about preserving freedoms, American democracy or the values that this country stands for.

I disagree, they do care about personal liberty and safety. If you are infringing on their rights, you aren't an ally.

>They never believed it in the first place, or their interpretation is so skewed it's meaningless.

This argument is so backwards it's hard for me to grasp. You have people saying "Ban guns! Ban guns!". Then the moment there's government overreach they cry, "where are the people with guns to defend us???"

I can tell you one thing: if the secret police were snatching 2A advocates off the streets, there would be a shooting war. This is why they want their guns, and right now, I'm sure they're happy they have them.

Re: Oregon, Journalists Sue U.S. over Portland Arrests, Violence

#78

Post by glogla » Sat, Jul 18, 2020, 6:21 PM UTC

META: It seems to me there's many accounts here with unsuspecting (kinda generated looking) names, barely any karma and posts - and if you look through their comments, they are very monothematical.

It would be interesting to see some analysis of posters in this discussion compared to "normal topic".

Re: Oregon, Journalists Sue U.S. over Portland Arrests, Violence

#79

Post by Google234 » Sat, Jul 18, 2020, 6:21 PM UTC

fzeroracer wrote: post #30

xenadu02 wrote: post #22

Secret police snatching people off the street in unmarked vehicles is 100% police state / gestapo behavior. No one should be OK with it.

Unfortunately the way I see people defend this sorta stuff is that they tend to work backwards. They were detained because they are obviously criminals and they are obviously criminals because they are protesters and are guilty by association. Though I have a feeling that if any of the anti-mask protesters were treated like this you'd see sentiment change rather rapidly.

The anti mask protesters were not trying to burn down federal buildings.

Re: Oregon, Journalists Sue U.S. over Portland Arrests, Violence

#80

Post by ZoomerCretin » Sat, Jul 18, 2020, 6:22 PM UTC

eanzenberg wrote: post #75

Antifa was declared a terrorist organization. They were seen as co-opting a movement, instigating with violence throughout the country, especially in poor neighborhoods, and attempting to start a race-war. However you may feel about the designation, the means to stop them are deemed serious enough to warrant these measures.

https://theintercept.com/2020/07/15/george-floyd-protests-po...