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New iOS privacy feature may end an era of personalized ads

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Re: New iOS privacy feature may end an era of personalized ads

#341

Post by sparker72678 »

While I applaud the feature and hope it gets used by everyone, the idea that it's going to harm FB/Google/Etc. is unlikely.

There's a good argument to be made here that it will actually _entrench_ them.

Facebook's power comes not just from being creepy, but by having built an internet-wide advertising platform that anyone can run ads on. You run ads in one place and billions of people can see them.

While IDFA blocking is nice, it does basically nothing to change FB's incentives. Until using the personal data they've collected to run ads is illegal, they'll continue to collect it (and probably after, let's be honest).

All the while, the complexities of running an effective ad network get higher and higher, making it harder for 3rd parties to compete against FB.

At the end of the day, we have to make ads targeted with previously collected personal data illegal. End of story.

Re: New iOS privacy feature may end an era of personalized ads

#342

Post by rgovostes »

jchook wrote: post #295
deeblering4 wrote: post #266

This is a big reason why I continue to use apple devices. They seem to be one of the few large tech companies that aligns themselves with users rights to privacy. Apple isn’t perfect. But they build very good privacy and security into their products. And they structure their UI and defaults in such a way that the average user benefits with no effort or specialized knowledge.

I definitely see some questionable privacy practices by Apple... - While "10x less", iPhone still sends your private information (such as location) to Apple on a regular basis[1]. - Apple encrypts iCloud backups with a key they control, not end-to-end[2]. This means that Apple can decrypt and inspect your phone and computer backups. - According to the article, iOS developers can use their "new privacy-focused ad fram…

In case you weren't aware, the accuracy of "The Big Hack" (3rd citation) has been widely called into question. There has been no corroboration of their claims, despite a lot of interest in locating one of these compromised servers. While it raises an important point about the plausibility of supply chain compromises (see NSA and Cisco), the case in the article has not been shown to be a matter of fact.

The story earned two sarcastic Pwnie Awards from the security industry last year, "Most Epic Fail" and "Most Overhyped Bug".

https://pwnies.com/previous/2019/most-epic-fail

https://pwnies.com/previous/2019/most-over-hyped-bug/

> - While "10x less", iPhone still sends your private information (such as location) to Apple on a regular basis[1].

Apple documents cases where private information is used, even if it is never sent off device. macOS and iOS users would be familiar with the interstitial privacy screens that show up the first time you use a feature.

iOS has always shown an icon in the status bar when the location information is accessed and provides a log of recent accesses. Recent versions have been more aggressive of reminding you when location data is being shared.

The most common reason location data is sent to Apple is for navigation purposes; if you opt into Location Services, Apple uses your device location for traffic aggregation. You can turn this off at any time.

> new privacy-focused ad framework

App developers incorporate ad frameworks to monetize their apps. An advertiser pays for an ad, and the ad framework displays it in the app. If the user taps on an ad, the framework communicates this back to its servers to make sure the app developer gets credit.

Most ad frameworks try to slurp up as much information as possible about the user in order to tailor more ads to them. Apple's new SKAdNetwork API does not send user information back to the network, only the app identifier that is needed for paying the app developer.

Re: New iOS privacy feature may end an era of personalized ads

#343

Post by rgovostes »

threeseed wrote: post #316
jchook wrote: post #295

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I definitely see some questionable privacy practices by Apple... - While "10x less", iPhone still sends your private information (such as location) to Apple on a regular basis[1]. - Apple encrypts iCloud backups with a key they control, not end-to-end[2]. This means that Apple can decrypt and inspect your phone and computer backups. - According to the article, iOS developers can use their "new privacy-focused ad fram…

1) The article never clarifies why Apple is sending location data. It could just be for the Find my Phone feature in which case users should just switch that off. 2) Apple doesn't have computer backups. But agreed that it isn't great that backups are not encrypted with my key. 3) It means Apple will provide information to advertisers about users but not in way that identifies them. Look into Differential Privacy. And…

> Apple doesn't have computer backups.

You've been able to back up iOS devices to a Mac or PC since the first iPhone came out, longer than iCloud has been around. Those backups are encrypted with your own key that Apple does not have access to.

Re: New iOS privacy feature may end an era of personalized ads

#344

Post by smart_jackal »

deeblering4 wrote: post #266

This is a big reason why I continue to use apple devices. They seem to be one of the few large tech companies that aligns themselves with users rights to privacy. Apple isn’t perfect. But they build very good privacy and security into their products. And they structure their UI and defaults in such a way that the average user benefits with no effort or specialized knowledge.

Most importantly, their interests directly align with users actually buying their products, not viewing ads on their products. Thus, they have a sort of vested interest in ensuring privacy (which is a product feature). The same cannot be said of Google's Android.

Re: New iOS privacy feature may end an era of personalized ads

#345

Post by username_my1 »

deeblering4 wrote: post #266

This is a big reason why I continue to use apple devices. They seem to be one of the few large tech companies that aligns themselves with users rights to privacy. Apple isn’t perfect. But they build very good privacy and security into their products. And they structure their UI and defaults in such a way that the average user benefits with no effort or specialized knowledge.

What I love about this move is that it's a double edged sword against google. ether google have to

1. cannibalize their main source of revenue and implement similar feature on Android and thus becoming a weaker competitor.

2. don't follow apple and let apple eat more of the smartphone market of people who worry about their privacy.

Apple doesn't make money from Ads, so it's strange that they waited this long to do this.

Re: New iOS privacy feature may end an era of personalized ads

#347

Post by thewebcount »

kin wrote: post #141

I have a serious question. Obviously if one were to choose between an ad-free experience and an ad-full experience, one would choose ad-free. But, if ads were needed for monetization, wouldn't you choose personalized vs non-personalized? Personally, I would go with personalized because a non-personalized experienced usually has no relevancy and frankly it is inefficient use of money in this world. From there, it real…

> But, if ads were needed for monetization, wouldn't you choose personalized vs non-personalized?

No. I simply do not ever look at ads. I've never, in 30 years of browsing the web, intentionally clicked on an ad.

Furthermore, I don't want a company keeping a dossier on me. The exchange of seeing ads for something I might want isn't worth the assault on my privacy, if it worked. And it doesn't work, so no thank you.

Re: New iOS privacy feature may end an era of personalized ads

#348

Post by amelius »

Fernicia wrote: post #170
m12k wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If personalized ads meant ads that were actually good recommendations for products I could be interested in and would be grateful to be informed about the existence of - maybe. The reality of it is that personalized ads are mostly just ads from those with the money and demographics info to stalk me around the internet - e.g. webshops running after me, believing that I abandoned my shopping cart simply because I got d…

Criticism like this essentially boil down to the adverts not being targeted enough. Lumping you in the wrong group, not knowing enough about your intentions, etc.

Perhaps you didn't read the last part of that comment:

> So long story short, personalized ads are just as useless to me as un-personalized ads, only creepier, and I'd prefer not to be stalked.

Re: New iOS privacy feature may end an era of personalized ads

#349

Post by jchook »

rgovostes wrote: post #342
jchook wrote: post #295

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I definitely see some questionable privacy practices by Apple... - While "10x less", iPhone still sends your private information (such as location) to Apple on a regular basis[1]. - Apple encrypts iCloud backups with a key they control, not end-to-end[2]. This means that Apple can decrypt and inspect your phone and computer backups. - According to the article, iOS developers can use their "new privacy-focused ad fram…

In case you weren't aware, the accuracy of "The Big Hack" (3rd citation) has been widely called into question. There has been no corroboration of their claims, despite a lot of interest in locating one of these compromised servers. While it raises an important point about the plausibility of supply chain compromises (see NSA and Cisco), the case in the article has not been shown to be a matter of fact. The story earn…

> ...the accuracy of "The Big Hack" (3rd citation) has been widely called into question.

Certainly, but we don't need that one story, as we have plenty others...

https://www.cnet.com/news/us-finds-huawei-has-backdoor-acces...

https://www.zdnet.com/article/former-pentagon-analyst-china-...

Re: New iOS privacy feature may end an era of personalized ads

#350

Post by throwaway5792 »

Silhouette wrote: post #292
lh7777 wrote: post #285

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is frustrating, but it doesn't bother me too much on the iPhone -- I can just not use iCloud and periodically back up my phone locally. I don't really need to sync anything but photos because I don't create or edit documents on my phone. On the other hand, the iPad is a very capable device for content creation, but I couldn't find a reliable way to sync files that doesn't leave them readable to Apple or another…

I don't really need to sync anything but photos because I don't create or edit documents on my phone. This is one of the key points. You can plug an iPhone into almost any modern PC, Apple or otherwise, and download the photos and videos. But you can't do the same for other types of data without using one or more of an Apple computer, specialist software or iCloud. The middle option, which is the only one not entirel…

What do you mean other types of data?
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