Teachers are ready to quit rather than put their lives at risk • Hacker News Board

Re: Teachers are ready to quit rather than put their lives at risk

#461

Post by nickff » Fri, Jul 17, 2020, 8:55 PM UTC

sfteus wrote: post #416

nickff wrote: post #374

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The manufacturer prices would be higher, thus triggering price gouging laws.

Price gouging is based on a reasonable price and is subjective. If the present situation results in inflated prices due to lack of materials or needing to run at a higher capacity, that's still reasonable. California, for example, has this written into their penal code, limiting it to a 10% increase in price of the total cost of manufacturing, which includes the increased cost of production, transportation or storage…

Would you take on the cost and risk of additional machines and employees for an ephemeral market and small margins?

Re: Teachers are ready to quit rather than put their lives at risk

#462

Post by dragonwriter » Fri, Jul 17, 2020, 8:56 PM UTC

rpiguy wrote: post #428

soared wrote: post #349

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can't honestly be saying that we're overreacting to COVID? I would hope someone in full PPE everyday has a much lower rate of COVID deaths. The US alone has more than 25% of global cases - comparing Europe to the US doesn't really make sense. They largely beat covid, the US obviously hasn't (see 70k new cases yesterday) More people die in car crashes than the flu - doesn't mean we don't spend trillions on road sa…

There is no science behind the lockdowns. There is no logic in keeping Walmart open but closing Sears for safety. Yes I believe it is absurd the level to which we have locked down the country. Some of the states that had the strictest lockdowns, NY, NJ, also had the worst outcomes. The purpose was never to stop the virus but to slow it. Growing cases does not concern me. Death rate has blipped up a little but no wher…

> Some of the states that had the strictest lockdowns, NY, NJ, also had the worst outcomes.

NYC metro ordered lockdowns after it was hard hit, because it was hit early on before there was a real understanding of what was going on.

A lot of other places still haven’t peaked, the reopening push in response to overall national case decline was driven entirely by NY being past it's peak while the rest of the country combined was still on the upswing.

> Growing cases does not concern me.

The growing list of places at or near ICU capacity should, though.

> Death rate has blipped up a little but no where near in proportion to the cases.

Since the peak death rate was when almost all the cases were in NYC when the NYC health system was overwhelmed, that's unsurprising, we shouldn't see similar death rates in proprtion to cases unless almost all the cases are in similarly overwhelmed locations, which because it hit different places at different times will, even with uncontrolled spread, take a little while.

But with enough cases, you can get a pretty apocalyptic total death toll without going back to the peak death:cases ratio.

Re: Teachers are ready to quit rather than put their lives at risk

#463

Post by diogenescynic » Fri, Jul 17, 2020, 8:56 PM UTC

slowhand09 wrote: post #432

diogenescynic wrote: post #258

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think homeschooling is usually like you're describing. Most of the people I have met who were homeschooled were not social adjusted or developed and didn't seem 'normal' by most standards. Most of them had parents who were either extremely religious or some other ideological tendency (survivalist, etc).

My nephews kids are homeschooled. They have a rigorous curriculum, specific goals, etc. They also have regular socialization activity with other homeschoolers. They just choose to not settle for the mediocrity, nor accept the indoctrination pushed by the education system.

No offense, but this is where it starts getting weird and into the whole "society is bad!" that seems pretty extreme:

>They just choose to not settle for the mediocrity, nor accept the indoctrination pushed by the education system.

Most people I know who went to public schools came out fairly well. I refuse to share this elitist/ideological attitude towards them. What indoctrination? Don't you think that's a rather general and blanket statement considering how varied each school district is? Maybe that's more of a criticism of how schools are run in your area.

Re: Teachers are ready to quit rather than put their lives at risk

#464

Post by mnm1 » Fri, Jul 17, 2020, 8:56 PM UTC

ceejayoz wrote: post #27

purple_ferret wrote: post #21

Serious question. At this point, why can't teachers wear n95 masks? Data has shown they adequately protect even healthcare workers that are constantly exposed to heavy viral loads.

> “They said we’d have masks and face shields and everyone is going to be covered, but it’s a school district — sometimes we don’t have soap,” he said. We've had trouble getting enough N95s for healthcare staff, let alone teachers.

Meanwhile multiple N95 production lines are sitting dormant in Texas and elsewhere. You're confusing not being willing to make masks with having trouble getting enough. No, we have no trouble getting enough. We have no willingness to make any. Those two couldn't be further from each other.

Re: Teachers are ready to quit rather than put their lives at risk

#465

Post by jimbokun » Fri, Jul 17, 2020, 8:56 PM UTC

ghufran_syed wrote: post #297

not2b wrote: post #230

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All of this is a consequence of ideologies that have become popular in the US both in politics and in business. Having government direct a mobilization is not acceptable. A mandate that people wear masks is not acceptable. Having manufacturing capacity to make low-value products in large numbers in the US is bad business when poorer countries can do it for less. Having spare inventory is bad, because just-in-time man…

So you think it would be better under a different political leader? I think it’s great that you’re still such an optimist

> So you think it would be better under a different political leader?

No US President in my living memory would have screwed this up as badly as Donald Trump has.

Re: Teachers are ready to quit rather than put their lives at risk

#466

Post by divbzero » Fri, Jul 17, 2020, 8:56 PM UTC

RestlessMind wrote: post #394

not2b wrote: post #230

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All of this is a consequence of ideologies that have become popular in the US both in politics and in business. Having government direct a mobilization is not acceptable. A mandate that people wear masks is not acceptable. Having manufacturing capacity to make low-value products in large numbers in the US is bad business when poorer countries can do it for less. Having spare inventory is bad, because just-in-time man…

> Having government direct a mobilization is not acceptable. Then you would expect divergent performance in the D-controlled states (eg. California) vs the R-controlled states (eg. Texas), no? So far, I see all types of states having similar outcomes. > ... good leadership ... but we chose someone who is committed to division, ... I'm no fan of our current leader, but let's be honest Obama failed to properly launch a…

> Then you would expect divergent performance in the D-controlled states (eg. California) vs the R-controlled states (eg. Texas), no?

It’s not so simple in that many states are miniature versions of our polarized country. For example, you have a Democratic governor facing Republican opposition in rural counties in Washington, and a Republican governor suing a Democratic mayor in Georgia.

Re: Teachers are ready to quit rather than put their lives at risk

#467

Post by RestlessMind » Fri, Jul 17, 2020, 8:57 PM UTC

charwalker wrote: post #451

seibelj wrote: post #228

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand the logic around the left's hatred of charters. Parents choose to send their kids there - if the existing public school was so good, why would they send them somewhere else? It's simply about choice, and sending your own kids to the best possible option. No one would ever deny their own children the best possible education available. It's so clearly about administrators and professionals over the n…

For me, it's because private, religiously focused schools can receive federal aid to indoctrinate children into said religion, dictate what is taught to increase indoctrination rates, and skate oversight. They are welcome to do this on their own dime, but as soon as taxpayer funding is involved all religious specific focus and values must be dropped. The school must no longer refuse employment or punish students base…

> If the best school in town is the religious charter school my property taxes are supporting, we have conflicts.

What is stopping other schools from improving their standards? After all, they also have access to the same public dollars and I am not aware of any funding imbalance between charter vs public schools (though please correct me if I am wrong here).

Re: Teachers are ready to quit rather than put their lives at risk

#468

Post by diogenescynic » Fri, Jul 17, 2020, 8:58 PM UTC

dragonwriter wrote: post #263

diogenescynic wrote: post #258

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think homeschooling is usually like you're describing. Most of the people I have met who were homeschooled were not social adjusted or developed and didn't seem 'normal' by most standards. Most of them had parents who were either extremely religious or some other ideological tendency (survivalist, etc).

> Most of the people I have met who were homeschooled The people you have met are probably not a representative sample of the population you would like to generalize to from your experience.

One anecdote counters another.

Re: Teachers are ready to quit rather than put their lives at risk

#469

Post by doorstar » Fri, Jul 17, 2020, 8:59 PM UTC

twblalock wrote: post #333

MattGaiser wrote: post #289

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even on the outside, it seems like pushing kids back into the classroom is poorly thought out. I can't imagine the shitshow it must seem like on the inside.

The problem is, remote education has been a complete disaster. I know a few teachers. Apparently their students found out that the state was unwilling to hold anyone back a year during the pandemic, they shared this information with each other, and now a substantial amount of them are not doing any work. In some classes, more than half the students are permanently absent! Either their parents don't know, or don't car…

The third solution is to suck it up and wait it out until there's a vaccine, which still may be as soon as December.

I hate having my kids out of school. Virtual learning is mostly useless. They are ( I think ) quietly becoming more and more withdrawn and I don't know how well they'll recover once things open up. We have two parents working from home and barely managing to stay productive.

Still I think sending kids back to the classroom is a terrible idea. I wouldn't be a school nurse for any amount of money. It's just not safe, and we can all still wait.

Re: Teachers are ready to quit rather than put their lives at risk

#470

Post by creaghpatr » Fri, Jul 17, 2020, 8:59 PM UTC

MattGaiser wrote: post #299

I have to ask you Americans. Are you giving up on society yet? I'm Canadian, and it is surreal watching the country below us completely waste the lockdown so they can go to beaches and bars and then urgently move to shoving kids back into the classroom. Do you still feel that you can count on your government? On your neighbours?

At least our President doesn't wear Blackface for kicks.