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Resignation Letter

bariweiss.com

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Re: Resignation Letter

#121

Post by some-guy »

deschutes wrote: post #85
alecb wrote: post #4

There's several layers of irony here, chief of which Bari Weiss headed a very vocal campaign to fire anyone at Colombia who didn't exist on the far-right on Israel/Palestine - and of course, falsely painted several professors as racist and anti-Semitic: https://theintercept.com/2018/03/08/the-nyts-bari-weiss-fals...

I'm not familiar with the controversy, so I went looking for actual views of said professors. Wikipedia states 'Massad has characterized Israel as "a racist Jewish state."' There might be more to this story than Glenn Greenwald frothing at the mouth.

And yet, if I'm reading Weiss's resignation letter correctly, you would think that Massad should not be fired for that characterization.

Re: Resignation Letter

#123

Post by seibelj »

jakelazaroff wrote: post #88
seibelj wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the latest argument from people who claim cancel culture doesn't exist. "How are you being silenced when everyone will read it from your high perch?" High-level writers need to push back against illiberal and anti-free speech proponents to give cover for the lower ranks. If even the top tier writers can't speak their mind, does the lowly intern or new hire stand a chance?

The problem with this rebuttal is that it assumes that the high–level writers and editors are not themselves the illiberal and anti–speech proponents, gatekeeping what perspectives are allowed to be represented in the first place. For example: Harper's Magazine, which published the recent open letter on cancel culture that Bari Weiss signed, doesn't pay its interns [1], ensuring that only those who can afford to work…

Rather than criticize the content of the letter, you attack Harper's for not paying interns, which is unrelated to the content. Classic tactic for silencing disagreement is to attack the source.

What do you disagree with in the Harper's letter itself (the content, not the publication or the signatories), and why?

Re: Resignation Letter

#124

Post by seppin »

mikece wrote: post #3

"Instead, a new consensus has emerged in the press, but perhaps especially at [the New York Times]: that truth isn't a process of collective discovery, but an orthodoxy already known to an enlightened few whose job is to inform everyone else." This is a very key point, and what are the consequences of "informing everyone of a truth" that doesn't accurately reflect -- of even contradicts! -- reality? Harm to the reput…

[flagged]

Re: Resignation Letter

#125

Post by s17n »

gfodor wrote: post #46
alecb wrote: post #4

There's several layers of irony here, chief of which Bari Weiss headed a very vocal campaign to fire anyone at Colombia who didn't exist on the far-right on Israel/Palestine - and of course, falsely painted several professors as racist and anti-Semitic: https://theintercept.com/2018/03/08/the-nyts-bari-weiss-fals...

Hilarious that the top comment exemplifies the problem. It seems few today are still able to engage with ideas directly, always trying to filter them through some, any, lens to discredit the ones they don’t like. Sometimes it’s attacking the speaker, sometimes their associations, sometimes the tweets they have “liked.” If all else fails, seek out language in the text itself for unfalsifiable “dog whistles” that allow…

Those who disagree with Bari Weiss have spent plenty of time and energy engaging with her ideas directly. At this point, it's pretty clear that she's a troll.

Re: Resignation Letter

#126

Post by manigandham »

alecb wrote: post #4

There's several layers of irony here, chief of which Bari Weiss headed a very vocal campaign to fire anyone at Colombia who didn't exist on the far-right on Israel/Palestine - and of course, falsely painted several professors as racist and anti-Semitic: https://theintercept.com/2018/03/08/the-nyts-bari-weiss-fals...

If true, this doesn’t disprove the stated criticisms in the letter but only further highlights how serious the issue is and how easily people fall into that behavior.

Re: Resignation Letter

#127

Post by qntty »

wait_a_minute wrote: post #6

That this is true at what is supposed to be a reputable publication like The New York Times makes me worried for companies and less known publications. Because if it's happening at the elite end of what is supposed to be curiosity-driven investigation, why wouldn't it be happening elsewhere? And so you end up with a culture where you can't speak about anything, where challenging the orthodoxy means you'll be forced i…

You don't have to believe in a naive worldview where the NYT supposedly used to be a principled newspaper in order to want people to behave more decently toward one another. There's always been things you can't say at the NYT. The new orthodoxy just represents a changing of the guard. America never was the place we tell ourselves that it was. Ask a socialist in the 50's about our noble tradition of free speech.

We should fight to make our world the ideal that it never was, but that doesn't mean we have to buy old lies about who we used to be.

Re: Resignation Letter

#128

Post by banads »

hangonhn wrote: post #37
wait_a_minute wrote: post #6

That this is true at what is supposed to be a reputable publication like The New York Times makes me worried for companies and less known publications. Because if it's happening at the elite end of what is supposed to be curiosity-driven investigation, why wouldn't it be happening elsewhere? And so you end up with a culture where you can't speak about anything, where challenging the orthodoxy means you'll be forced i…

Wait. We're only hearing it from one point of view. Rather than calling for action, should we not also hear other view points or do some investigation or research first? Isn't knee-jerk calls to action contributing to what you seen to fear?

Maybe if there weren't already countless other supporting, self-evident examples in recent history

Re: Resignation Letter

#129

Post by throwaway894345 »

jakelazaroff wrote: post #10
ReptileMan wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Since she hasn't filed discrimination lawsuit, I read it as mocking the victim culture that prevades the others.

I don't see how this can be read as mockery: > There are terms for all of this: unlawful discrimination, hostile work environment, and constructive discharge. I’m no legal expert. But I know that this is wrong. This is what claiming victimhood looks like.

There's nothing wrong with "claiming victimhood" when one is rightly a victim. The problem is exaggerating everything to make oneself appear to be a victim, especially appeals to one's identity as a member of a historically oppressed group, to exploit the social protections we afford to bona fide victims. If Bari's claims (that she was unlawfully discriminated against, subjected to a hostile work environment, and constructively discharged) are substantiated, then she's a bona fide victim. And given what has come out about NYT internal culture in recent months and years as well as the supporting evidence she provides for her claims, I find it hard to disbelieve her.

Re: Resignation Letter

#130

Post by chasing »

mikece wrote: post #39

"And so self-censorship has become the norm." This might be the most ironic and most dangerous effect of this "right think" regime: that the free expression and exchange of ideas is thwarted in advance because one doesn't want to deal with drama, fight, or insults that come with saying something not in lock-step with the prevailing group-think. This blunts the curiosity of the intellect and silences all true disciple…

Oh, please. If you say dumb or offensive stuff, people are going to react. It's not the "right think regime" — it's people disagreeing, often with some extra acid if you're a high profile New York Times opinion columnist and readers don't feel you deserve that kind of an international platform for your words.
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