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Resignation Letter

bariweiss.com

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Re: Resignation Letter

#61

Post by deleuze »

seibelj wrote: post #30
jakelazaroff wrote: post #7

> All this bodes ill, especially for independent-minded young writers and editors paying close attention to what they’ll have to do to advance in their careers. Rule One: Speak your mind at your own peril. Rule Two: Never risk commissioning a story that goes against the narrative. Rule Three: Never believe an editor or publisher who urges you to go against the grain. Eventually, the publisher will cave to the mob, th…

This is the latest argument from people who claim cancel culture doesn't exist. "How are you being silenced when everyone will read it from your high perch?" High-level writers need to push back against illiberal and anti-free speech proponents to give cover for the lower ranks. If even the top tier writers can't speak their mind, does the lowly intern or new hire stand a chance?

I'll start caring more about this "silencing" once the NYT editorial board starts including viewpoints that are actually silenced in our society. Until then, it's just whining about no longer being free from criticism.

Re: Resignation Letter

#62

Post by Barrin92 »

gfodor wrote: post #46
alecb wrote: post #4

There's several layers of irony here, chief of which Bari Weiss headed a very vocal campaign to fire anyone at Colombia who didn't exist on the far-right on Israel/Palestine - and of course, falsely painted several professors as racist and anti-Semitic: https://theintercept.com/2018/03/08/the-nyts-bari-weiss-fals...

Hilarious that the top comment exemplifies the problem. It seems few today are still able to engage with ideas directly, always trying to filter them through some, any, lens to discredit the ones they don’t like. Sometimes it’s attacking the speaker, sometimes their associations, sometimes the tweets they have “liked.” If all else fails, seek out language in the text itself for unfalsifiable “dog whistles” that allow…

In this particular case the author argues from her particular experience in her workplace without providing any evidence, so I think it's pretty relevant to take such things into account because she might be exaggerating.

I'm not exactly inclined to take someone's purely personal criticisms at face value if they have engaged in the same behaviour.

For all we know she might be leaving on bad terms and is taking it out on her coworkers who may have a different story to tell.

Re: Resignation Letter

#63

Post by Redoubts »

dimgl wrote: post #54
gfodor wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hilarious that the top comment exemplifies the problem. It seems few today are still able to engage with ideas directly, always trying to filter them through some, any, lens to discredit the ones they don’t like. Sometimes it’s attacking the speaker, sometimes their associations, sometimes the tweets they have “liked.” If all else fails, seek out language in the text itself for unfalsifiable “dog whistles” that allow…

It's truly telling that the most upvoted comment is one working to discredit the writer, rather than taking what's being said at face value.

> rather than taking what's being said at face value

Why should I be this credulous?

Re: Resignation Letter

#64

Post by dimgl »

cs702 wrote: post #40

I hesitated before upvoting the OP, and even considered flagging it, given its controversial author (with whom I disagree) and its potential to fuel ideologically driven, opinionated arguments (in which no one wins and everyone loses). However, I decided to upvote the OP because I feel it is, in the end, about a topic that is of utmost interest of -- and widely considered important by -- most people on HN: free speec…

Why would you flag it without reading the article?

Re: Resignation Letter

#65

Post by banads »

alecb wrote: post #4

There's several layers of irony here, chief of which Bari Weiss headed a very vocal campaign to fire anyone at Colombia who didn't exist on the far-right on Israel/Palestine - and of course, falsely painted several professors as racist and anti-Semitic: https://theintercept.com/2018/03/08/the-nyts-bari-weiss-fals...

The irony is inherent in the ideology. This is just one of many examples of that irony on full public display, cannibalizing itself.

Re: Resignation Letter

#66

Post by deleuze »

LegitShady wrote: post #58
deleuze wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bari Weiss has been a proponent of censorship and "cancel culture" since her time as a student. She's a hypocrite.

I agree she was a proponent but the cancel culture has finally come for her and she has figured it out, so she isn't wrong here. It will be interesting to see if anything changes later The most important thing is how this affects your perception of the nyt Edit hacker News wont let me post anymore right now but the question is if she is right here or not. She doesn't owe you anything just like you dont owe her anythi…

Where's her mean culpa on Israel Palestine then? I see no evidence that she's changed.

Re: Resignation Letter

#67

Post by kup0 »

gfodor wrote: post #46
alecb wrote: post #4

There's several layers of irony here, chief of which Bari Weiss headed a very vocal campaign to fire anyone at Colombia who didn't exist on the far-right on Israel/Palestine - and of course, falsely painted several professors as racist and anti-Semitic: https://theintercept.com/2018/03/08/the-nyts-bari-weiss-fals...

Hilarious that the top comment exemplifies the problem. It seems few today are still able to engage with ideas directly, always trying to filter them through some, any, lens to discredit the ones they don’t like. Sometimes it’s attacking the speaker, sometimes their associations, sometimes the tweets they have “liked.” If all else fails, seek out language in the text itself for unfalsifiable “dog whistles” that allow…

Look, I believe people can change, but how they've behaved previously, especially as recently as in the case (2 years ago) is relevant to now.

Especially when the very arguments they are making- they were recently, actively working against

Re: Resignation Letter

#68

Post by slg »

ReptileMan wrote: post #9
slg wrote: post #5

It always amazes me when the people who champion "the centrality of the free exchange of ideas to a democratic society" will also turn around and say something like their political beliefs being mocking by coworkers is "unlawful discrimination". She doesn't want free speech. She wants consequence free speech. She wants her detractors silenced by the law. What a hypocrite.

Since she hasn't filed discrimination lawsuit, I read it as mocking the victim culture that prevades the others.

I can't definitively determine her exact intent with that paragraph. However the downvotes and response to your comment indicate your interpretation is likely the minority opinion here. Weiss's job is to communicate with the written word. If the most common interpretation of her writing is the opposite of her intent, doesn't that inherently mean she is bad at her job?

Re: Resignation Letter

#69

Post by horsemessiah »

alecb wrote: post #4

There's several layers of irony here, chief of which Bari Weiss headed a very vocal campaign to fire anyone at Colombia who didn't exist on the far-right on Israel/Palestine - and of course, falsely painted several professors as racist and anti-Semitic: https://theintercept.com/2018/03/08/the-nyts-bari-weiss-fals...

Yeah, this letter she wrote is a joke.

Re: Resignation Letter

#70

Post by jeffbee »

jakelazaroff wrote: post #25
ReptileMan wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well the Tom Cotton op ed drama was literally this.

Tom Cotton is a sitting US Senator. Denying him op–ed space is in no way tantamount to "silencing" him.

Also they didn't deny him anything. His idiotic vomit ran above the fold online. The Times admitted the opinion editor didn't even read the piece, they just ran it automatically out of deference to the senator.
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