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German court bans Tesla ad statements related to autonomous driving

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Re: German court bans Tesla ad statements related to autonomous driving

#11

Post by Alupis »

H8crilA wrote: post #2

Tesla has been selling level 5 autonomy since 2016. I can see nothing wrong with that. Definitely not vaporware /s https://www.tesla.com/blog/all-tesla-cars-being-produced-now...

I realize this is a sarcastic comment, but I think this illustrates the problem.

Tesla vehicles cannot operate fully autonomous as-of now. Tesla has no idea if they'll need to replace or upgrade hardware either. They simply have not solved the problem yet, but want everyone to buy into the hype. And, the hype machine is working, unfortunately.

Re: German court bans Tesla ad statements related to autonomous driving

#12

Post by bgorman »

I wonder how much BMW/Daimler/Volkswagen had to do with this.

It is a common practice for technology companies to offer features that will only become available after a certain time period. It actually takes time and money to build these features.

I'm sure the fact that BMW/Daimler/VW have completely botched their EV/Autonomous vehicle strategy and the automotive industry is Germany's cash cow has nothing at all to do with the court's decision.

Disclosure: I do not any automotive companies stock, and I am a dual US/German citizen.

Re: German court bans Tesla ad statements related to autonomous driving

#13

Post by mrtksn »

This was probably the most brilliant advertising scheme of all times. Tesla is not just an electric car, it's the self driving car brand - even if it doesn't actually do that.

I believe banning this kind of advertisement will only cement Tesla's image as the "Self Driving Car company" as no other company would be able to replicate it. People will continue to post memes about self driving Teslas but no one else would be able to claim anything like that up until they actually make a self driving car, and if they do it before Tesla, when people hear about it they will say "Oh cool!, So just like a Tesla?".

Re: German court bans Tesla ad statements related to autonomous driving

#14

Post by catalogia »

chrisseaton wrote: post #5
dkonofalski wrote: post #3

I agree with this wholeheartedly, even as a Tesla owner. Tesla goofed from the beginning by calling tech like "Autosteer" and "Traffic Assisted Cruise Control" under the moniker "Autopilot" while shifting everything above that to "Full Self-Driving". They should have called it "CoPilot" since that infers that you're still the driver in charge of controlling the vehicle and it would have had exactly the same reception…

> They should have called it "CoPilot" [rather than "AutoPilot"] Huh but a co-pilot is much more capable than an auto-pilot system. An auto-pilot mostly keeps you level, going the right speed, and pointing in the right direction, and can do some limited landing and things. That sounds to me exactly like what Tesla's system does? A co-pilot is a human who can take complete control from you for the rest of the whole fl…

The problem with this line of reasoning is that the general public has an inaccurate understanding of what airplane autopilots are capable of. The belief that modern airline pilots just push a button to turn on the plane then take a nap until the plane lands is widespread.

In naming their system after a system the public has a poor understanding of, Tesla is being misleading.

Re: German court bans Tesla ad statements related to autonomous driving

#15

Post by csunbird »

bgorman wrote: post #12

I wonder how much BMW/Daimler/Volkswagen had to do with this. It is a common practice for technology companies to offer features that will only become available after a certain time period. It actually takes time and money to build these features. I'm sure the fact that BMW/Daimler/VW have completely botched their EV/Autonomous vehicle strategy and the automotive industry is Germany's cash cow has nothing at all to d…

Whether the decision was influenced by German car makers, I think the decision is correct. The car is not fully autonomous and requires your hands on the wheel all the times.

Re: German court bans Tesla ad statements related to autonomous driving

#16

Post by LoSboccacc »

chrisseaton wrote: post #5
dkonofalski wrote: post #3

I agree with this wholeheartedly, even as a Tesla owner. Tesla goofed from the beginning by calling tech like "Autosteer" and "Traffic Assisted Cruise Control" under the moniker "Autopilot" while shifting everything above that to "Full Self-Driving". They should have called it "CoPilot" since that infers that you're still the driver in charge of controlling the vehicle and it would have had exactly the same reception…

> They should have called it "CoPilot" [rather than "AutoPilot"] Huh but a co-pilot is much more capable than an auto-pilot system. An auto-pilot mostly keeps you level, going the right speed, and pointing in the right direction, and can do some limited landing and things. That sounds to me exactly like what Tesla's system does? A co-pilot is a human who can take complete control from you for the rest of the whole fl…

"All Tesla cars come with Full Self Driving Capability"

they even replaced - hardware to - capability to be even more ambiguous.

Re: German court bans Tesla ad statements related to autonomous driving

#17

Post by Barrin92 »

itchyjunk wrote: post #7

Do regulators have an idea of what test a car needs to pass to be able to claim certain things? It there were levels of tests and passing each gave you better rating, that might give everyone an idea of there the system is. But most of the talks about this type of stuff seems to be gut feeling rating. Someone will say they think some car/software is good, other's will say it's no where close and the conversation ends…

>Do regulators have an idea of what test a car needs to pass to be able to claim certain things? It there were levels of tests and passing each gave you better rating, that might give everyone an idea of there the system is.

The 'five levels' of autonomy are fairly well established by now. Full autonomy generally is defined as driving capability that does not involve human attention, that is to say it is what the name suggests, the vehicle drives itself, you could ship it to the consumer without a steering wheel.

Re: German court bans Tesla ad statements related to autonomous driving

#18

Post by aaomidi »

catalogia wrote: post #14
chrisseaton wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> They should have called it "CoPilot" [rather than "AutoPilot"] Huh but a co-pilot is much more capable than an auto-pilot system. An auto-pilot mostly keeps you level, going the right speed, and pointing in the right direction, and can do some limited landing and things. That sounds to me exactly like what Tesla's system does? A co-pilot is a human who can take complete control from you for the rest of the whole fl…

The problem with this line of reasoning is that the general public has an inaccurate understanding of what airplane autopilots are capable of. The belief that modern airline pilots just push a button to turn on the plane then take a nap until the plane lands is widespread. In naming their system after a system the public has a poor understanding of, Tesla is being misleading.

Tesla conveniently used a word where it actually means something far simpler than what the general public knows it to mean.

Tesla knew this but they did it anyway because $$$.

Re: German court bans Tesla ad statements related to autonomous driving

#19

Post by NeutronStar »

dkonofalski wrote: post #3

I agree with this wholeheartedly, even as a Tesla owner. Tesla goofed from the beginning by calling tech like "Autosteer" and "Traffic Assisted Cruise Control" under the moniker "Autopilot" while shifting everything above that to "Full Self-Driving". They should have called it "CoPilot" since that infers that you're still the driver in charge of controlling the vehicle and it would have had exactly the same reception…

The issue is one of definition. I don't know why people associate autopilot with a definition that isn't autopilot.

An autopilot is a system used to control the trajectory of an aircraft, marine craft or spacecraft without requiring constant manual control by a human operator. Autopilot does not replace human operators. Instead, autopilot assists the operator's control of the vehicle, allowing the operator to focus on broader aspects of operations (for example, monitoring the trajectory, weather and on-board systems) [0]

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Autopilot

Re: German court bans Tesla ad statements related to autonomous driving

#20

Post by catalogia »

perbu wrote: post #8
dkonofalski wrote: post #3

I agree with this wholeheartedly, even as a Tesla owner. Tesla goofed from the beginning by calling tech like "Autosteer" and "Traffic Assisted Cruise Control" under the moniker "Autopilot" while shifting everything above that to "Full Self-Driving". They should have called it "CoPilot" since that infers that you're still the driver in charge of controlling the vehicle and it would have had exactly the same reception…

Have you flown on autopilot? It maintains speed, height and direction. It doesn't land or take off. Originally it couldn't even turn.

Some can land in some conditions. However take off is still done by pilots in everything other than a few experimental aircraft.
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