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Is It Time to Kill the Penny?

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141–150 of 428 posts

Re: Is It Time to Kill the Penny?

#141

Yes. Canada stopped producing pennies in the fall of 2012. [0] The sky didn't fall. There was no great debate, no public opinion polls and politicians swearing heartily about the demise of our great nation. (Ok that's probably not true. For too many politicians that's all they do.) There was resistance when Canada dropped the $1 bill in favour of a Loonie (a $1 coin with the image of a loon on it). People bitched abo…

> This is a key difference between US policy & Canadian policy that I have informally noticed while growing up on the border (with family ties on both sides). My wife's Canadian and I'm American, and we've discussed this point too. My theory is that Canada's parliamentary system generally puts one party in charge of the executive and legislative, so it's easier for that party to get things done. Of course there are t…

I've always thought of two factors in Canadian federal politics that make a huge difference operationally: Many political parties (diversity of platforms/views), and the vote of no confidence.

Canada generally has at least three official political parties (more than 12 seats in the house) at any given time. Currently there are four. You need the most seats but not necessarily a majority of seats to form a government. If a party has fewer than 50%, they form what's called a minority government.

Next big piece is the motion of no confidence, which means we can have an election literally whenever if a government can't pass legislation.

So combine the chance of minority governments and more voices and platforms in government the possibility that obstruction can actually cause you to, you know, lose your job, and you get natural checks against a lot of the problems on display in American federal politics right now. If you can't pass a budget, you don't get a federal shutdown until you negotiate one, you get an election triggered immediately. I understand why no confidence would be practically impossible in America due to money and insanely long election cycles, but it really helps form coalitions and collaboration in Canadian politics.

Re: Is It Time to Kill the Penny?

#142
I know this is about the US penny, but from a UK perspective I think it'd be much more useful to kill the two pence piece. Those coins are massive and, in my experience, never used except to put in those charity buckets. One pennies, however small their monetary value, at least help you make up odd prices, but twos are always just too much to make up a £2.47 bus fare.

Re: Is It Time to Kill the Penny?

#144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Paper money isn't waterproof in the US.

Yes it is. It will get soggy, but once it dries it will be perfectly fine. It's mostly cotton, isn't it?

But they rip when wet. They also rip when dry!

British, Canadian, Australian bank notes can't be ripped when wet or dry - they're polymer.

Re: Is It Time to Kill the Penny?

#145
post #142

I know this is about the US penny, but from a UK perspective I think it'd be much more useful to kill the two pence piece. Those coins are massive and, in my experience, never used except to put in those charity buckets. One pennies, however small their monetary value, at least help you make up odd prices, but twos are always just too much to make up a £2.47 bus fare.

£2.46, even. If only the bus driver would fat finger the ticket machine, maybe 2p coins would have a use.

Re: Is It Time to Kill the Penny?

#146
post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the best approach is for the US to move more concerns to the state level. E.g., it would be great if states would start implementing their own universal healthcare for their residents. States commonly have more internally aligned political goals and therefore can move quicker. It also has the benefit of allowing different states to experiment with different solutions and all states can learn from the results.…

Trivial inter-state mobility is a big obstacle for states doing grand social programs individually. If a state provided universal healthcare for residents, it'd quickly be overwhelmed with "hard cases" from other states where coverage is a problem. Which would drive up costs, and taxes, and drive productive/healthy people out. See the current inter-state shipping of homeless people, especially those who suffer mental…

Canada it is a "state"/provincial system. All provinces manage their own. Canada doesn't get inundated with Americans because if they do come, patients will be charged like private health care. If the patient's home province has universal health care, both province's will just work it out.

In general, we don't dump problems on to other provinces. It's bad form and federal courts will fix that quick especially with so much money on the line. If Florida state sends patients to a universal health care NY state for care, you can bet, NY State will be suing either residents of Florida for medical bills or Florida State directly.

Re: Is It Time to Kill the Penny?

#147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This is a key difference between US policy & Canadian policy that I have informally noticed while growing up on the border (with family ties on both sides). My wife's Canadian and I'm American, and we've discussed this point too. My theory is that Canada's parliamentary system generally puts one party in charge of the executive and legislative, so it's easier for that party to get things done. Of course there are t…

I don't think that's the case myself. While I do think that the parliamentary system is better than the congressional system, I think it's more that the parliamentary system emphasises consensus-building and executive accountability more. This is especially apparent in countries where a form of proportional representation is used for elections.

What you're leaving out, in Canada's case, is that the norm is a strict party-line vote. In rare cases, the PM will allow a "conscience vote", where individuals vote as they will; in every other case, you vote as your party directs or you're kicked out of the party. As party-line voting is the norm, sitting as an independent is basically worthless in terms of accomplishing anything--no access to party resources or assignments.

So in practice, the PM of a majority gov't (i.e., has a majority of seats) gets to pass whatever they want to pass; the saving grace of this is that, without having to haggle and herd cats and trade horses, the legislation is the legislation--there's no poison pills, no payoff amendments, no loopholes to capture one person's support, and no extreme bits to trade away. It's just "this is the law we want", which I think leads to higher quality legislation over all.

The PM of a minority gov't (i.e., only has a plurality of seats) may have to secure another party's vote to pass, but that's a negotiation with a second entity, not a hundred other voting entities.

Consensus doesn't play a significant part in it, I believe. Within the bounds of the law, the PM of a majority is nearly a polite dictator.

Re: Is It Time to Kill the Penny?

#148
post #90

Yes. Canada stopped producing pennies in the fall of 2012. [0] The sky didn't fall. There was no great debate, no public opinion polls and politicians swearing heartily about the demise of our great nation. (Ok that's probably not true. For too many politicians that's all they do.) There was resistance when Canada dropped the $1 bill in favour of a Loonie (a $1 coin with the image of a loon on it). People bitched abo…

> Since Canada changed but left the taxes the same (14% in Ontario IIRC) there seems to be a lot of rounding-off in favour of companies instead of consumers. $0.01-$0.02 per transaction This assertion is wrong. If the item you buy is $1.00, then after your 14% tax it will be $1.14, which is rounded up to $1.15. If the item is $2.00, then after tax it is $2.28, which also rounds up to $2.30. But if the item is $3.00,…

Regardless of what the practice is in Canada, I have zero faith in literally any US business to round down on anything, at anytime, for any reason at all. It will, I guarantee, be round up on everything.

Re: Is It Time to Kill the Penny?

#149

Yes. Canada stopped producing pennies in the fall of 2012. [0] The sky didn't fall. There was no great debate, no public opinion polls and politicians swearing heartily about the demise of our great nation. (Ok that's probably not true. For too many politicians that's all they do.) There was resistance when Canada dropped the $1 bill in favour of a Loonie (a $1 coin with the image of a loon on it). People bitched abo…

> This is a key difference between US policy & Canadian policy that I have informally noticed while growing up on the border (with family ties on both sides). My wife's Canadian and I'm American, and we've discussed this point too. My theory is that Canada's parliamentary system generally puts one party in charge of the executive and legislative, so it's easier for that party to get things done. Of course there are t…

We seriously have to take a look at how parliamentary systems work. I remember our political science teacher told us that the only country where the presidential system actually works is the US. That was 20 years ago. I think that is no longer true.

Re: Is It Time to Kill the Penny?

#150
post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually, the pricing of individual items doesn't change. (Not least because of GST the price you pay at the till is not the sticker price.) Where I live the 1c and 2c coins were killed some time ago. The smallest coin now is a 5c. The way it works is that you go to the checkout, get a final total. If you pay cash then the change is "rounded up" to the nearest 5c mark. If you pay via card you pay the exact amount. It…

> GST. Found the Australian!

At the risk of making a flippant comment, they /are/ called Bruce.
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