Huawei 5G kit must be removed from UK by 2027 • Hacker News Board

Re: Huawei 5G kit must be removed from UK by 2027

#131

Post by rashkov » Tue, Jul 14, 2020, 1:13 PM UTC

jk20 wrote: post #60

U.S. is just concerned that China, and not them, will get an edge in spying and the next industrial revolution. Speaking of human rights it should be noted that U.S. not only wantonly attacks or bullies other countries, but it also has the highest incarceration rate in the world - in absolute terms the number of inmates is comparable to that of China and India combined.

Regarding your first point, yes, that’s an interesting take. Regarding the criticism of the US, yes you’re probably correct, but this is a “what about” argument that doesn’t really aid the discussion in my opinion.

Re: Huawei 5G kit must be removed from UK by 2027

#132

Post by [deleted] » Tue, Jul 14, 2020, 1:13 PM UTC

culturestate wrote: post #35

mytailorisrich wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The alternative to Huawei in 5G is either Nokia or Ericsson. As an European I don't what to think that the US seems so against kit from a Chinese company and completely fine with kit from an European company. They should be worried about both. We also have a long term world domination plan (version 2.0)... ;)

> As an European I don't what to think that the US seems so against kit from a Chinese company and completely fine with jit from an European company. The US would of course prefer that American technology be available, but since it's not then I suppose a partnership with two trusted allies is preferable to one with an untrusted adversary. Nokia and Ericsson also aren't arms of the state widely believed (fairly or not…

[deleted]

Re: Huawei 5G kit must be removed from UK by 2027

#133

Post by free_rms » Tue, Jul 14, 2020, 1:14 PM UTC

room271 wrote: post #9

This kind of thing is going to play out a lot over the next few years. It's a tough question: how to marry globalisation with the political realities. When China was very poor, it didn't really matter, or perhaps the assumption was that China would liberalise more quickly than it has. But China, while increasingly mature economically, has not developed proper civil society, human rights, freedom of expression, democr…

Different != Improper.

They're not perfect, but over the last 30 years they lifted half a billion out of poverty and didn't wage war all over the world.

Not everything needs to be wrapped in our style of propaganda, sometimes it can be wrapped in other brands instead.

Re: Huawei 5G kit must be removed from UK by 2027

#134

Post by Waterfall » Tue, Jul 14, 2020, 1:15 PM UTC

__alexs wrote: post #102

Waterfall wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

China puts their own citizens in concentration camps. They're using machine learning to generate social scores. If you don't like America or the UK, you can leave. Try doing that in China. Dying in a free zone is preferable to the enslavement that the Chinese are subjected to. Freedom has a price, and it's not racist to not like these horrible cultural values or to go against them.

> China puts their own citizens in concentration camps. Is putting other countries citizens in concentration camps somehow morally superior? > They're using machine learning to generate social scores. America also has this they just call it a "credit score" or "klout". > If you don't like America or the UK, you can leave. Wow all my US expat friends who constantly complain about having to pay US taxes despite living…

Yes. The point is not to hurt your own civilians, aka civilization. I don't even understand why you question that.

Our credit system is bad and theirs is worst. Next topic?

They can at any point renounce their citizenship, but they don't and continue to pay their taxes.

I grew up with cultural values, and I don't like the Chinese ones. Does that mean the US is perfect? Of course not.

Whataboutism is cushioning the evil creeping, instead of trying to stop the incoming flood, you're busy mopping up the puddle.

Re: Huawei 5G kit must be removed from UK by 2027

#135

Post by kwistzhaderach » Tue, Jul 14, 2020, 1:16 PM UTC

3PercentMan wrote: post #77

room271 wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure it's just a China-US thing. I think Europe will increasingly find itself taking a role. India too. To clarify, while US-China superficially seem like the 'sides'. Really, what I think is happening is that the values of many (especially Western) countries around human rights, democracy, freedom of religion and expression, are coming into conflict with a new kind of Chinese authoritarianism that really doe…

Enough of your nonsense. You don't have the higher moral grounds when it comes to human rights. How many Muslims have been killed during the wars in the middle east? Stop smoking crack already and getting high on koolaid.

What makes you think he’s American?

Re: Huawei 5G kit must be removed from UK by 2027

#136

Post by LatteLazy » Tue, Jul 14, 2020, 1:16 PM UTC

aaron695 wrote: post #31

Given we've found zero proof that China has ever put backdoors in hardware. And the devastation to their economy if we did find backdoors which would forever poison Chinese electronics is a far greater security risk to them, than any advantage they may possibly get from implementing backdoors. I assume it's actually because 5G has to be found causing the Coronvirus and they are covering it up?

You're right about back doors, but this is about (like it or not) supporting the US and sanctioning China without saying so (likely a good think because of coronavirus, HK, minorities, democracy, etc).

Re: Huawei 5G kit must be removed from UK by 2027

#137

Post by jaekash » Tue, Jul 14, 2020, 1:16 PM UTC

throwawaybab323 wrote: post #130

jaekash wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Every nation does this with their indigenous population. And it is always wrong. > Yet you don't seem to be outraged at the fact native americans are raped and murdered almost everyday in america. Not under sanction of the state, and Non native americans are also raped and murdered almost every day in america. These things are crimes in USA regardless of the victim, where in China the state is sanctioning it and do…

[flagged]

It is a bit weird that there are whole movements like BDS setup against Isreal, a wholly democratic and liberal country where people of all religions enjoy the same rights and nobody is placed in concentration camps, while every time someone mentions that China is a bad actor we get asked why does BDS not exists.

BDS does exist, and China is a bad actor and should be opposed.

Re: Huawei 5G kit must be removed from UK by 2027

#138

Post by kwistzhaderach » Tue, Jul 14, 2020, 1:17 PM UTC

mr_gibbins wrote: post #57

What a short-sighted, backwards knee-jerk, racist reaction. If Huawei's 5G infrastructure had leaks allowing Chinese control it would more than likely be spotted by UK engineers. The application of controls as simple as IP whitelists or air-gapped systems helps ensure no leakage. Transparency of schematics and specifications means both Chinese and UK engineers get to see what's going on.

Yes the UK is delaying their technology simply because they are ‘racist’

Re: Huawei 5G kit must be removed from UK by 2027

#139

Post by beezle » Tue, Jul 14, 2020, 1:17 PM UTC

gberger wrote: post #4

The justification is that the equipment presents a national security risk. If that's true, how is it reasonable to allow this equipment to operate in the UK for 7 more years? Doesn't that mean the UK is willingly under national security risk for 7 years? Unless, of course, there was never a security risk...

Because it will be obsolete and 6G will be the new hotness in seven years.

Re: Huawei 5G kit must be removed from UK by 2027

#140

Post by someperson » Tue, Jul 14, 2020, 1:18 PM UTC

abc-xyz wrote: post #99

rich_sasha wrote: post #38

If this is just Realpolitik/hardware independence, fine, but security..? Any worthwhile Internet traffic should be encrypted in 2020, and if it isn’t, Huawei probably isn’t the most immediate concern. And if it is encrypted, does it really matter who is listening? Comments welcome, I know zilch about telecoms hardware.

You probably wouldn’t see a browser as a security risk either. In a recent example, all the big Chinese browsers blocked or rewrote the content on GitHub’s 996 repo. Imagine if Chinese browsers became mainstream, then they could rewrite Wikipedia articles, insert their own links/propaganda in google results, Facebook feeds, change download links to include a version bundled with spyware, etc. They already demonstrate…

It's worth noting that Qihoo 360 owns the Opera Web Browser, which incidentally offers a Free VPN to protect your privacy. The Qihoo 360 Browser, Tencent QQ Browser and Xiaomi smartphone's native browser all reportedly blocks the GitHub "996.icu" repository [1]. It seems likely such client-side censorship also reports the attempted access to the Chinese government authorities for further investigation.

Other than the risks of using Opera (and other software like AirDroid, TikTok, WeChat etc), the main way I currently see users outside China being affected by similar issues is if they use Chinese Android devices, including grocery store smartphones, or those popular HDMI android dongles.

China's export of technological-enabled totalitarianism and surveillance states (especially to developing countries) is accelerating.

[1] https://www.scmp.com/abacus/culture/article/3029260/chinese-...