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Dealing with Insomnia

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Re: Dealing with Insomnia

#81

Post by elric »

TheAdamAndChe wrote: post #45

I'm reading this book(Why We Sleep by Matthew Walker) right now. The number one piece of advice it provides is to set an alarm to go to bed and try to fall asleep at the same time every night, even on weekends. Other pieces of advice include lowering the temperature to 65°F at night(really), reduce or stop caffeine and alcohol intake, avoid screen time and light at night, and several other pieces of advice. It's an o…

I enjoyed the book. If you're interested, my comment history on HN contains a reference to i somewhere, where someone linked to serious criticism about many of the book's claims, and a reply to said criticism by Matthew Walker.

Regarding the alarms: I find that consistency is much more important for mee than total hours of sleep. I'm much better on a consistent 7h/day than on 8h/day where my sleep/wake time moves around.

Re: Dealing with Insomnia

#82

Post by derefr »

caymanjim wrote: post #76
derefr wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Humans are built for constant labor. We're the endurance-running champions of the animal kingdom. I mean, sure, we can do that. But most of our ape relatives lay about all day socializing and taking advantage of their social cohesiveness to hunt-and-gather very quickly (and then get back to lazing around.) They have many capabilities, but rarely use them, because social organization is just so OP compared to the de…

Apes spend over 50% of their day chewing food, and most of the rest sitting around digesting. Their diets are low-energy and they really can't do much else. We require over 25% more calories (adjusted for total body mass). There are some large physiological differences. This is what they're doing while socializing. We really are turbocharged engines by comparison. Our bodies are still adjusting, poorly, to the shift…

Have there been any studies on the differences in behavior of apes fed high-calorie diets? (Presumably non-interventionist studies, of e.g. apes that scavenge from urban areas encroaching into their habitats.)

For that matter, how about the "city" monkeys of Lopburi, who eat human food (either from human offerings, or by stealing it)? Anyone looked into their sleep cycles?

Re: Dealing with Insomnia

#83

Post by keenmaster »

verylittlemeat wrote: post #59

I'm 30 and just went through the most serious bout of insomnia in my life. It was nothing like the insomnia I read about or saw in media. The crux of my insomnia was anxiety. I was dead tired and sleep deprived but as soon as I laid down my mind and heart would race. I couldn't convince myself to relax with any of the mind tricks in this thread. I would get so mad and frustrated that I would try to will myself to sle…

What in tarnation, that sounds like a product idea. Maybe that works because the vibrations draw your attention in a multi-sensory way, forcing your racing thoughts to a halt. Maybe there’s also a Pavlovian response. Vibration = sleep

Re: Dealing with Insomnia

#84

Post by keenmaster »

Brushfire wrote: post #14

I’ve struggled with insomnia my whole adult life and I can tell you the three factors that have helped the most are, in order: - removing caffeine completely - getting enough direct sunlight (hours per day) - losing weight Everything else (melatonin, blue light, exercise, sleepy tea, other drugs, etc) never helped or made my quality of life worse.

Caffeine is too useful for me to give up entirely. I had similar success with a rule: no caffeine after 12 PM (not even caffeinated soft drinks). Caffeine has a long half-life, which is especially problematic for people who, for genetic reasons, respond more to a given amount of caffeine. What I usually do is I have 2 cups of coffee back to back before 11 A.M. I feel the benefits for most of the day. It may be tempting to violate the rule and have an afternoon coffee “just this once” at the beginning but you get used to it. Furthermore, if you feel the need for more coffee in the afternoon, that’s a sign that your work habits and distractions need to change, not your physical energy level.

Re: Dealing with Insomnia

#85

Post by _tom_ »

caymanjim wrote: post #29

I think my biggest problem is that I don't exhaust myself physically. Humans are built for constant labor. We're the endurance-running champions of the animal kingdom. As recently as last century, almost all jobs were physically exhausting. Mind work is exhausting as well, but in a different way. At the end of a strenuous day of coding, and endless meetings, I'm drained. Completely wiped out. I feel physically exhaus…

That's why I started dancing (ballroom, etc), after a day job of coding.

You need to work your mind, and your body, if you want to sleep. I could come home feeling exhausted, but that was all mental. I could get up and dance for hours, and feel great.

But if I tried to go to sleep without exercise, it was hard. My body wanted to do something.

Any type exercise would probably work, I used to do weights before bed, that worked very well. I slept like a log.

Re: Dealing with Insomnia

#86

Post by verylittlemeat »

keenmaster wrote: post #83
verylittlemeat wrote: post #59

I'm 30 and just went through the most serious bout of insomnia in my life. It was nothing like the insomnia I read about or saw in media. The crux of my insomnia was anxiety. I was dead tired and sleep deprived but as soon as I laid down my mind and heart would race. I couldn't convince myself to relax with any of the mind tricks in this thread. I would get so mad and frustrated that I would try to will myself to sle…

What in tarnation, that sounds like a product idea. Maybe that works because the vibrations draw your attention in a multi-sensory way, forcing your racing thoughts to a halt. Maybe there’s also a Pavlovian response. Vibration = sleep

You should try it and see what you think. I thought of other fancier designs like using "bass kickers" or transducers as a more permanent solution. Honestly though I'm just happy that I found something to help me sleep. If you're willing to put in the time/effort to turn it into a product go for it.

The idea came to me as a coincidence. During my insomnia I came across this product [0] in a hacker news comment. I was so tired and delusional that I figured I'm basically just a cranky baby +150 lbs.

[0] https://www.happiestbaby.com/

Re: Dealing with Insomnia

#87

Post by non-entity »

I've always had trouble sleeping but the conditions around the coronavirus have made it increasingly worse.

I've been able to force myself to sleep recently with enough sleep aids, but the amount I have to take to knock me out is terrible because it lasts so long into the next day. Whereas previously I may have had to fight microsleeps if I was particularly sleep deprived, I find myself having to fight full on passing out until mid afternoon at least.

This, is a huge must for me:

> Absolutely no intra-day napping. When I violate this rule (as I still sometimes do) I usually have a bad night.

Prior to wfh, I would often come home from the office completely drained. Even i did nothing at all and just sat aroud the exhaustion was worse than the rare occasion I get physical exercise these days. It almost felt like my brain was calling me to bed. But I've learned taking naps almost certainly means I wont sleep the coming night.

Re: Dealing with Insomnia

#88

Post by flowerlad »

ComputerGuru wrote: post #63
flowerlad wrote: post #46

Try magnesium. Stress depletes magnesium. The cells in our body need magnesium and calcium for their operation. When you're low on magnesium your cells can't go into off state. When that happens your muscles become stiffer and you can't sleep. Magnesium supplementation is the solution. "Supplementation of 500 mg of Mg has been associated with significant improvement in the insomnia severity index, sleep time, sleep e…

Thanks for providing the links on the benefits of sleep linked to magnesium, but can you provide a link for this: > Stress depletes magnesium.

I don't have any peer-reviewed research publications on this, but here's a magazine article:

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/evolutionary-psychia...

Quote: "stress causes us to waste our magnesium like crazy"

Re: Dealing with Insomnia

#89

Post by flowerlad »

verylittlemeat wrote: post #62
flowerlad wrote: post #46

Try magnesium. Stress depletes magnesium. The cells in our body need magnesium and calcium for their operation. When you're low on magnesium your cells can't go into off state. When that happens your muscles become stiffer and you can't sleep. Magnesium supplementation is the solution. "Supplementation of 500 mg of Mg has been associated with significant improvement in the insomnia severity index, sleep time, sleep e…

I've been reading good things about KAL magnesium glycinate in various contexts. There seems to be at least 10 different types of magnesium (oxide/glycinate/citrate/etc). Can you recommend any of these in particular?

Magnesium Glycinate Lysinate seems to work well for me. Also, magnesium l-threonate seems to work well for insomnia.

Re: Dealing with Insomnia

#90

Post by chillytoes »

flowerlad wrote: post #46

Try magnesium. Stress depletes magnesium. The cells in our body need magnesium and calcium for their operation. When you're low on magnesium your cells can't go into off state. When that happens your muscles become stiffer and you can't sleep. Magnesium supplementation is the solution. "Supplementation of 500 mg of Mg has been associated with significant improvement in the insomnia severity index, sleep time, sleep e…

Trying magnesium after reading about it on HN comments last year changed my life. Definitely try it. I just use magnesium citrate from Walgreens.
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