71–80 of 243 posts
China is a horrific, authoritarian monster. I hope this century sees their vision checked and reduced back to the edges of humanity.
In the last 40 years, while China lifted a billion people out of poverty, what evil did they commit that is even remotely comparable to what the US did in, say, Iraq?
The Sino-British Joint Declaration was a mistake. What did they think would happen? If not now then what about in 2047?! Were they hoping that was enough time to warm the new generations to the idea of giving up their rights? There is no fixing this, but I appreciate the effort by the British. Many will not want to leave, understandably. But the threat of draining HK is an interesting sort of pressure to put on China…
Everything that has happened in HK so far conforms to the HK constitution as well as Beijing’s, whether it meets the spirit of the declaration or not
Earlier quoted context omitted.
Suppressing the Tianenmen Square uprising. From a UK diplomatic cable describing the scene: > STUDENTS LINKED ARMS BUT WERE MOWN DOWN INCLUDING SOLDIERS. APCS THEN RAN OVER BODIES TIME AND TIME AGAIN TO MAKE QUOTE PIE UNQUOTE AND REMAINS COLLECTED BY BULLDOZER. REMAINS INCINERATED AND THEN HOSED DOWN DRAINS. Say what you will about the US, we still haven’t run citizens over with tanks and hosed them down drains. Sour…
Tanks are a bit showy when you can just have the police and National Guard shoot protestors without consequence: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kent_State_shootings https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/People%27s_Park_(Berkeley) Shooting workers that unionized was also common: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lattimer_massacre https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anaconda_Road_massacre https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Columbine…
But anyone with a gun can pull the trigger. It takes an enormous amount of coordination to uniformly run over people with tanks, burn their bodies, and flush them down drains.
The incidents you’ve linked are undoubtedly dark chapters, but they are not comparable to what we’ve seen in China.
I hope this doesn't get ugly when people try to actually leave. On the bright side, I wonder what good things this will do for the UK. I doubt many of these people will vote Torry.
And, with rayiner I suspect that many will remember which party opened the door for them, even decades from now.
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That’s what I keep thinking: this is a dry-run sewing if they’ll get meaningful backlash from the next U.S. President.
Taiwan and Hong Kong couldn’t be more different though. Hong Kong legislature (heavily influenced by China) passed this law (edit: this turns out not to be true). Hong Kong is already part of China. You don’t have 200km of water to cross against a country that’s prepared for just that. There’s no TSMC. If it’s a dry run for Taiwan, it’s a really shitty one.
China's legislature amended Hong Kong's constitution to add the new national security law precisely because the Hong Kong legislature - even under heavy influence by mainland China - was unable to pass it.
China is a horrific, authoritarian monster. I hope this century sees their vision checked and reduced back to the edges of humanity.
In the last 40 years, while China lifted a billion people out of poverty, what evil did they commit that is even remotely comparable to what the US did in, say, Iraq?
Earlier quoted context omitted.
Tanks are a bit showy when you can just have the police and National Guard shoot protestors without consequence: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kent_State_shootings https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/People%27s_Park_(Berkeley) Shooting workers that unionized was also common: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lattimer_massacre https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anaconda_Road_massacre https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Columbine…
>Tanks are a bit showy when you can just have the police and National Guard shoot protestors without consequence: uhh... what? Have you checked the "legal action" section? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kent_State_shootings#Legal_act... or did you expect that the guards' heads be put on a pike? Oh, and don't forget that we can talk about what happened freely. Try doing that in China.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
In the last 40 years, while China lifted a billion people out of poverty, what evil did they commit that is even remotely comparable to what the US did in, say, Iraq?
Black jails everywhere where dissidents are tortured. Religious prisoners harvested alive. Repeated invasions of Vietnam. Tienanmen Square massacre and the subsequent rounding up of a generation in concentration camps. Ethnic cleaning of the Uyghurs. Stamping out of Tibet's culture and media blackout of the mass self-immolation epidemic. Imposition of the worlds worst surveillance-state. The CCP is not China.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
Taiwan and Hong Kong couldn’t be more different though. Hong Kong legislature (heavily influenced by China) passed this law (edit: this turns out not to be true). Hong Kong is already part of China. You don’t have 200km of water to cross against a country that’s prepared for just that. There’s no TSMC. If it’s a dry run for Taiwan, it’s a really shitty one.
This is factually incorrect. China's legislature amended Hong Kong's constitution to add the new national security law precisely because the Hong Kong legislature - even under heavy influence by mainland China - was unable to pass it.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Say what you will about the US, we still haven’t run citizens over with tanks and hosed them down drains. do you know what happened in iraq?
The united states is, on balance, a rather stupid country. We re-elected a dolt that invaded Iraq on the premise they caused 911 when they obviously didnt. That said, China poses a unique threat: a panopticon, freedom supressing government, with next to no option for change, and trying to expand its borders. Scary.
I personally see no difference between the two except they're both fighting to be the world superpower and China is really stepping in to take that role from a USA in distress.