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How to Understand Things

nabeelqu.co

61–70 of 121 posts

Re: How to Understand Things

#61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

i agree. I think this is why I find companies like tesla and spacex exciting. They seem to have set up incentive structures that encourage _both_ quick execution and innovation (which requires deep understanding). One thing he's said that really struck me is that it's _really_ difficult to produce innovation if you tie punishment to failure. People tend to be conservative if they are punished / think they will be pun…

well that's where the whole mantra of "move fast and break things" comes from. Putting it out there and failing also accelerates you faster to the right answers. If you release it today, it'll take 6 more months of iteration to really get it right. Or maybe you spend an extra 2 years of development to get it "right", but then once you release, you'll still have to spend 3 more months of iteration anyways to get it ri…

yeah, this hits home for me because my team just spent a couple of years trying to get a product right and now it's on the verge of being replaced.

I think I've typically associated that mantra with pure software companies, so it's surprising when a company does this with rockets

Re: How to Understand Things

#62
The points about education really resonate with me. In my engineering undergrad, it was frustrating to see in our applied math courses that the mechanical plugging and chugging of equations was the approach that most of my peers took in their studies. They got better grades than me. I wanted to understand concepts more deeply, but there was no time, and the tests rewarded those who could simply go through the motions of applying formulae to problems.

Re: How to Understand Things

#64
post #44
post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> says you need to master each step on the track before moving onto the next one. this is poisonous and borderline evil What’s wrong with it? You do need to understand calculus before classical mechanics, classical mechanics before quantum mechanics, quantum mechanics before quantum field theory, and quantum field theory before the Standard Model. I’ve seen tons of people disregard this and the result is always confu…

It didn't work for the GP. That makes it poisonous and evil. I've seen this sentiment way too much on HN. X didn't work for me, therefore X is a scam, its perpetrators are evil sociopaths, and if it worked for you you're a cog in the machine, man .

I'm a believer in individual learning styles, and hard as it is for me to understand personally, I do recognize that lots of people may learn best by lecture and drill. I certainly don't think bad of them for it. but many more people are not suited for this, and forcing them through the education system as it exists does them great harm, and I empathize strongly with them

Re: How to Understand Things

#65
> not understanding something — or having a bug in your thinking — bothers you a lot.

I find this to be true for nearly all of the best co-workers I've had. I think this is the same reason people enjoy debugging software. It's the computer telling you that there's a bug in your thinking

Re: How to Understand Things

#66

> This quality of “not stopping at an unsatisfactory answer” deserves some examination. > This requires a lot of intrinsic motivation, because it’s so hard; so most people simply don’t do it. It also requires self-confidence, persuasiveness, and social power. Without these traits, your attempts to really understand something will be dismissed as "overthinking things" or "trying to understand the universe". Those arou…

Your points about social context are great ones and 100% valid, but I want to make a case for "stop thinking just do the task": --- Often, trying (and potentially failing) to do a task is the best way to learn about it. The key is to be very explicit about what parts of that task you actually understand and which ones you're pulling out of your ass. This is especially true when creating software. It's super rare to h…

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Re: How to Understand Things

#67
post #10

Heh I get this a lot in my daily sysadmin/developer duties. When you need to turn on a knob somewhere you don't just wanna know that you have to turn it on, you want to know why you need to turn it on and follow the chain up until you get to facts you already know. But it's not always possible to get that far, there's too many layers of abstraction, the source code is not available or you just don't have the time.

I can draw a parallel to this in software development. Some product features that require development "from scratch", where you can get down to the original code and logic - this is where "taking time to think" really pays off. But when you are basically composing a final product from components, libraries and features - this is where figuring something out may take really long time and a lot of effort. It today's wo…

Where do you find this "fundamental" kind of work? How do you select for it?

Re: How to Understand Things

#68

Is this consciousness? IQ being the biggest life changer. Consciousness is considered second and more importantly is considered trainable.

Since spellcheck killed that -

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conscientiousness

It's part of the ‘Big Five’ factor of personality. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Five_personality_traits

It's interesting when Jordan Peterson was asked what he has been wrong about, he said he did not initially believe in the Big Five personality traits.

It fits with the hardware(IQ) and software(conscientiousness) analogy

Re: How to Understand Things

#69

Oh my lord, why is Jesus in that list?

because it's actually quite relevant. The quality that the author is talking about is simply faith. Genuine intellectual activity is the recognition that there is a gap between how you understand the world and that there is is a more genuine degree of understanding to be found.

Because there's no guarantee of success the attitude one needs to adopt is the same attitude a believer needs to have, which is to take a leap of faith.

And like genuine faith, genuine intellectual activity is not goal oriented. If you only think to optimise your shopping list or make more money, you're impoverishing your own thinking by making it subject to what basically amounts some meaningless goal, that is to say you're instrumentalising thinking. Just like being faithful so you end up on God's or the churches good side is an impoverished version of belief.

Re: How to Understand Things

#70
post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I suspect lots of people go through the entire education system like this. +1. it took me a couple years after getting kicked out of college to get my head sorted out to the point where I felt like I could "think" again I think one of the most harmful things about schooling is the way it imposes a tracked structure on learning. it demarcates knowledge into discrete subjects and sets up a linear progression through t…

> says you need to master each step on the track before moving onto the next one. this is poisonous and borderline evil What’s wrong with it? You do need to understand calculus before classical mechanics, classical mechanics before quantum mechanics, quantum mechanics before quantum field theory, and quantum field theory before the Standard Model. I’ve seen tons of people disregard this and the result is always confu…

calculus is required to understand classical mechanics, but intuitions about classical mechanics can inform and accelerate how you learn calculus. I actually tutored calc 1 a little bit in college and most of the time the people I was helping could do the calculations asked of them fine, but felt lost and confused because they didn't know what the output actually meant. everyone learns linear algebra before abstract algebra, but even a little background in the latter creates many opportunities to think "ohhh, this is just like X!" that make the former easier to pick up--and when you revist the latter, you'll probably understand it better too because of the connections you made

is it better to learn python or java to build a cursory understanding of programming, and then c and x86 to see what "really" happens "under the hood?" or the other way around, starting from base operations and then layering abstractions on top? I don't think one is strictly better than the other. when I first learned sql, joins were intuitively obvious to me but bewildered the person I was learning with, despite the fact that he'd been in IT for years and I barely knew how to program, because I happened to know set theory. I wonder what it would be like to do the traditional algorithms and data structures stuff before ever learning to program. it might make picking up a lot of details easier! I wonder why we don't teach children logic gates and binary arithmetic before they learn decimal. it's actually simpler!

in general I don't think there's a good reason why you must teach raw technique before practical application, or a concrete special case before a broader abstraction. even an impefect understanding of something "higher" can give you hooks to attach information about something "lower." familiarity and comfort and an understanding of interrelationships between knowledge is so much more valuable than perfectly executing each step on a given track

when I want to get acquainted with a new field, I usually start by reading current research, barely understand any of it, and then work backwards through the author's previous papers and the papers he cites habitually. my cursory grasp on the latest version makes it easier to understand earlier sketchier versions, and at the same time the development history of the older shines light on the newer. sure you can always "start with the greeks" as it were and work your way up, but I don't think this is objectively better than going the opposite direction

really I think of knowledge as more a highly interconnected graph than a series of linear tracks. as long as you can anchor something somewhere it's valuable to pick it up. it can reinforce other things near it and you can strengthen your understanding of it over time. and getting into the practice of slotting arbitrary things together like this is good training for drawing novel inferences between seemingly disparate topics, which I think is the most valuable form of insight there is

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