Don't close your MacBook with a cover over the camera • Hacker News Board

Re: Don't close your MacBook with a cover over the camera

#851

Post by gpmcadam » Sat, Jul 11, 2020, 12:02 PM UTC

jlnthws wrote: post #736

gtm1260 wrote: post #20

I was very skeptical of the camera covers, but then through conversations with some of my co-workers, I realized that they weren't being used because people were worried about spies secretly turning on the camera. It was 90% of the time just peace of mind that their camera was actually off, instead of having to find the sometimes hard to see options in video chat programs etc.

I've always used a sticker (black dot-shaped) or a piece of post-it note. Post-it is really convenient but it's ugly. I still think the best solution would be to have no builtin camera or microphone. Just have something like the iSight that you manually and thus willingly connect to your thunderbolt. Works with your external monitor as well and you can orient it the way you like. It would also have better overall ima…

This is never the best solution for notebooks though, is it?

Re: Don't close your MacBook with a cover over the camera

#852

Post by catoc » Sat, Jul 11, 2020, 12:10 PM UTC

No amount of tech or trust beats a black sticky tape. Thin enough to not damage anything; Removed and re-applied in a second without leaving residu; Zero discussion whether it will work or not

Re: Don't close your MacBook with a cover over the camera

#853

Post by brailsafe » Sat, Jul 11, 2020, 12:10 PM UTC

Seems like most/all ppl in this thread are also missing the bit where MacBooks are just too thin; so much so, that it's hard to even protect the fragile coating on the screen from damage without something as thin as printer paper in between it and the keyboard. It's hard for me to remember to put that piece of paper in there every time, but if I forget, I risk oils from the keyboard getting on the screen and permanently erodong the anti-reflective coating.

Re: Don't close your MacBook with a cover over the camera

#854

Post by collinmanderson » Sat, Jul 11, 2020, 12:12 PM UTC

It would be nice if I could acknowledge missed phone calls on my Mac without turning my camera on.

I believe it’s only possible with the FaceTime app, which turns the camera on when opening the app.

Re: Don't close your MacBook with a cover over the camera

#855

Post by collinmanderson » Sat, Jul 11, 2020, 12:14 PM UTC

drusepth wrote: post #701

mekster wrote: post #418

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right. And some apps like WebEx turn on the camera by default, which is insane but happens and until you click to turn it off, you're live. Also, if you're using an external display, then how are you supposed to notice the green light on the MacBook sitting next to the display? That Apple article is nonsense. I put a black tape over the camera and I know nothing including hacks can broadcast unintended scene. It's ea…

>Right. And some apps like WebEx turn on the camera by default, which is insane but happens and until you click to turn it off, you're live. Not to mention apps that do it "right" like Hangouts that enable the camera for you to preview your video feed before you're actually live. Could be pretty confusing/concerning for someone who isn't used to an app (and when it broadcasts you or not) and sees the light come on. A…

Yeah, It would be nice if I could acknowledge missed phone calls on my Mac without turning my camera on.

I believe it’s only possible with the FaceTime app, which turns the camera on when opening the app.

Re: Don't close your MacBook with a cover over the camera

#856

Post by def8cefe » Sat, Jul 11, 2020, 12:24 PM UTC

Kliment wrote: post #792

happytoexplain wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly this. I use one for these reasons, in descending order of practical concern: 1. I don't want to broadcast myself during a meeting when I'm not prepared, or perhaps leave a meeting open by accident. 2. If a bad actor does access my camera, I won't necessarily notice the indicator light, especially if I'm not actively using the computer at that moment. 3. I don't trust the indicator light to be permanently unha…

Same on all counts, though I went a step further and wired in a microminiature slide switch to completely power off the camera. That way applications see "no camera" unless I go out of my way to power it on. I painted the "on" side of the switch in retroreflective paint so I can see when it's on at a glance too, whether the camera is in use or not. This was on a thinkpad though, I doubt macos would tolerate a disappe…

Do you have pictures to share? Sounds cool.

Re: Don't close your MacBook with a cover over the camera

#857

Post by abbadadda » Sat, Jul 11, 2020, 12:32 PM UTC

> Designed to protect your privacy, Mac notebooks have a camera indicator light to let you know when the camera is on.

LOL

Re: Don't close your MacBook with a cover over the camera

#858

Post by t31 » Sat, Jul 11, 2020, 12:32 PM UTC

collinmanderson wrote: post #854

It would be nice if I could acknowledge missed phone calls on my Mac without turning my camera on. I believe it’s only possible with the FaceTime app, which turns the camera on when opening the app.

Yep, and keeps it on, my housemate has Facetime open all the time and no camera cover, every time I walk by his laptop the camera light is on, defeating the point of it if it's always on?

Re: Don't close your MacBook with a cover over the camera

#859

Post by aaanotherhnfolk » Sat, Jul 11, 2020, 12:36 PM UTC

soulofmischief wrote: post #160

If you close your Mac notebook with a camera cover installed, you might damage your display because the clearance between the display and keyboard is designed to very tight tolerances. Doesn't this sound like an engineering oversight and not a user error? Why are camera covers not just part of the design? My phone camera physically retracts when not in use.

Reminds me of the whole "you're holding it wrong" antenna event. Where Apple's design failed and they tried to blame it on the users.

The desired user experience is peace of mind from a physical barrier; no amount of LED bulb hidden behind the flush surface is going to solve for that.

It's also like the keyboard keys. User experience has taken a back seat to Apple's product design goals as they pertain to their bottom line. Products users love are expensive to build and maintain, so Apple won't make them. When you can't grow profits selling more devices, you start to cut corners on the ones you _are_ selling.

Re: Don't close your MacBook with a cover over the camera

#860

Post by sfgweilr4f » Sat, Jul 11, 2020, 12:39 PM UTC

I'll put tape over the camera. Apple can't reasonably provide guarantees about the camera. I have reasonable doubt they can't provide privacy around that camera with the current designs.

This is true even if the indicator light only powers on when the camera is on. That is not enough guarantee.

This is also true even if the indicator stays on for several seconds after the camera was in use. I might not notice that indicator so there is no guarantee from that either.

Even with hardware keys, encryption and everything else, none of it beats a cover over the camera. A sliding or moving physical cover always wins. That is the guarantee. But Apple will not allow or tolerate that. Because they emphasize design over function.

So, close your device with a cover over the camera with a thin piece of tape. Its up to Apple to make that possible without damage.

Any other answer is interesting but not a guarantee. There is always some caveat to the suggestions. But an actual sliding or otherwise physical cover always wins.

Perhaps we might even address the microphone issue...