What if a bad actor activates the cam for less than 10ms at a time or less time that the LED takes to kick on
Don't close your MacBook with a cover over the camera
441–450 of 990 posts
Re: Don't close your MacBook with a cover over the camera
#442None of the proposed solutions do anything to actually stop the camera from taking a picture of you. Sure, you'll see the indicator light up for 3 seconds. But the attacker still got what they needed.
Camera covers have nothing to do with identifying compromise. They are strictly for preventing compromise. This is exactly opposite what a camera indicator light does, and thus the indicator should not be considered a "workaround" for not being able to install a camera cover.
Re: Don't close your MacBook with a cover over the camera
#443Nice try FBI
Re: Don't close your MacBook with a cover over the camera
#444Earlier quoted context omitted.
This is the only correct design, yet almost nobody does this. One of the challenges is verifying that this was done correctly. You may be able to verify a design like this once with a teardown, but it's impractical to verify your particular device, and next to impossible to re-verify this every time you leave your laptop unattended.
My work laptop (a Thinkpad) has a built-in plastic slider that physically covers the camera. If something activates the camera while that cover is closed, it won't see anything.
Not only that, but this feature is also present in X1, which is plenty thin.
Re: Don't close your MacBook with a cover over the camera
#445Earlier quoted context omitted.
But can't you specifically wire the indicator light to always be lit if the camera has power? I don't see Apple claiming they've done that but a correct design would make the indicator light work that way and be related to software at all. Meaning you could only disable the indicator light by physically modifying the device.
This has been the case for quite some time (10 years or so). I've torn apart two Macbooks to specifically test this and the LED is enabled when the camera receives power. It's impossible to disable with software. You can modify the Macbook of course, which is why the paranoid type will still use tape. Some attacks I've seen will take a photo with the camera as fast as possible so you might not notice, but the light w…
> You can modify the Macbook of course, which is why the paranoid type will still use tape.
If the attacker has done this, they might as well just hide the camera somewhere else.
Re: Don't close your MacBook with a cover over the camera
#446If they cared about protecting privacy, they could add a physical shutter. Nothing hard about it.
Re: Don't close your MacBook with a cover over the camera
#447Earlier quoted context omitted.
Unfortunately, they're not even as good as phone front cameras because laptop screens are so thin. So people who do a lot of video chatting typically set up an external webcam or even a real camera in video mode.
Do you have statistics on this? And do they take into account the dichotomy of mostly-mobile and mostly-stationary users?
The camera quality is pretty obvious just by making Webex calls on a laptop. I don’t actually know if getting extra equipment is popular, just seen howto articles recently on dpreview.
Fujifilm and Canon have added webcam support to their DSLRs though, which is interesting.
Re: Don't close your MacBook with a cover over the camera
#448Earlier quoted context omitted.
>2013: iSeeYou: Disabling the MacBook Webcam Indicator LED https://jscholarship.library.jhu.edu/handle/1774.2/36569 ... applies only to older Mac notebooks from like 2008 period which are long since obsolete according to Apple's announced support policy. >2016: Your Mac’s Camera Can Be Hacked https://www.intego.com/mac-security-blog/your-macs-camera-ca... . ... refers specifically the exploit above. >2016: Former NSA…
There's a reason Zukerberg's laptop has its mic and camera tapped up. It doesn't matter what device you use unless there's a physical switch to disconnect it'll never be safe. Software can ALWAYS have zero days, just because it hasn't been exploited yet doesn't mean it can't be.
The irony of this is too much. The guy who pioneered privacy invasion as a philosophy is guarding his own privacy. He should have a Facebook live stream following him 24/7
Re: Don't close your MacBook with a cover over the camera
#449I think the underlying stupidity is that no matter how good or bad the indicator is, that’s is fundamentally different than blocking the camera altogether.
This is like telling you to not use a lock if you have an alarm.
Re: Don't close your MacBook with a cover over the camera
#450So, Apple has done a nice job of making the sure the LED comes on when the webcam is in use. Unfortunately, there are still very good use cases for webcam covers.
- The computer has malware which controls the webcam. Although it's nice that the light correctly alerts you the webcam is in use, the malware can still get some pictures off before you can act.
- You're not very good with computers, and so you don't know how to change Zoom settings, and you want a surefire way to ensure that you camera will not be active when you join a call.
- You're just fine with computers, but the app has changed its defaults for some reason, and/or;
- Your company mandates a new app which you're either not familiar with, or doesn't have appropriate settings.