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Slate Star Codex and Silicon Valley’s War Against the Media

newyorker.com

191–200 of 584 posts

Re: Slate Star Codex and Silicon Valley’s War Against the Media

#191
post #55

Sigh. I think this article is holding Scott, and a core constituency of posters and meet up people, guilty by association with every rando on the internet, and also about half of the celebrities in the Bay area. "War against the media" strikes me as ridiculous hyperbole in this context. I have met some of these people in real life, and none of them expressed that attitude to me, nor any kind of utopian superiority. I…

There are only two rational explanations here: 1) Scott Alexander wanted more attention, and he realized that deleting his site and blaming the NYT for it would garner dramatically more attention, creating opportunities that he wanted. He recognized that he could become a martyr to a certain group, and use that for future gains. 2) Scott Alexander is an absolute moron who did not foresee the Streisand Effect that he…

What's your definition of smart? Left wing?

Re: Slate Star Codex and Silicon Valley’s War Against the Media

#192

What an ugly article. A couple quotes: > It remains possible that Alexander vaporized his blog not because he thought it would force Metz’s hand but because he feared that a Times reporter wouldn’t have to poke around for very long to turn up a creditable reason for negative coverage. The reporter is unaware that the Internet Archive exists? The content is obviously still readily available, so the reporter is either…

Parts of this read as a smoothed-over hit piece. An honest and comprehensive effort to rip apart and debunk neo-reactionary ideology is painted guilt-by-association style as "possibly legitimizing" or "describing" it. "[Exploring] and [upholding] research into innate biological differences between men and women" is "[giving] safe harbor to some genuinely egregious ideas". Asking people to politely contact the editor…

I got the same impression. Even though it's couched in "respectful language", they really went out of their way to cover the half-dozen or so most cringe-worthy controversies to ever come out of SSC or SSC-adjacent spaces, whether it's relevant at all or not to the (very tenuous) point of the article.

Like, you really have to bring up Roko's basilisk? What is the point, besides "look at how silly these Silicon Valley types are"? They present it like a central example of "Grey Tribe" discourse, when it's pretty fringe, even by LessWrong standards.

Re: Slate Star Codex and Silicon Valley’s War Against the Media

#193
> Until recently, I was a writer for the Times Magazine, and the idea that anyone on the organization’s masthead would direct a reporter to take down a niche blogger because he didn’t like paywalls, or he promoted a petition about a professor, or, really, for any other reason, is ludicrous;

Niche? A blog that get's 600K page views a month and is highly regarded (aruably even moreso than the NYT) by numerous intellectuals and public figures?

I will concede that perhaps no one would direct a reporter to take down Scott. However, that leaves open the possibility that they tend to hire the kind of people who would take on that initiative themselves. As Noam Chomsky once told a reporter "I'm sure you actually say what you believe, but you would not have your job if you believed differently".

> For one thing, the S.S.C. code prioritizes semantic precision, but Metz—if Alexander’s account is to be taken at its word—had proposed not to “doxx” Alexander but to de-anonymize him

What, pray tell, is the difference?

> as if these supposed inconsistencies were dispositive proof of the paper’s secret agenda, rather than an ad-hoc and perhaps clumsy application of a flexible policy.

They also have previously given anonymity to a psychiatrist political blogger for the exact reasons Scott asked for anonymity. I think there was really very little differences between Scott and this other blogger, but I'm sure we can all guess what those differences might be.

> They have given safe harbor to some genuinely egregious ideas, and controversial opinions have not been limited to the comments.

Merely arguing against neo-reactionaries (rather than banning the outright/deplatforming them) is considered providing "safe-harbor"? This is why the re-assurances of benign intent don't hold much water.

> in which Alexander explored and upheld research into innate biological differences between men and women. (As it turned out, the Damore memo was written before the post, but there was a noticeable overlap between them.)

If I recall correcty, that post was actually a sort of defense of Damore (or at least a response to Damore's detractors).

> Many technologists and their investors believe that media coverage of their domain has become histrionic and punitive, scapegoating tech companies for their inability to solve extremely difficult problems, such as political polarization, that are neither of their own devising nor within their ability to solve.

Not that I don't share skepticism of SV, but I see no self-reflection here on whether skepticism of corporate media is ever justified.

--

At the very least the author didn't doxx Scott.

Re: Slate Star Codex and Silicon Valley’s War Against the Media

#194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All purpose's defenders will claim that theirs is not frivolous.

Meaning that no non-frivolous purpose exists?

I'm not sure if it means that. I'm just sure that for each purpose, we can find someone that relies on it.

Re: Slate Star Codex and Silicon Valley’s War Against the Media

#195

What an ugly article. A couple quotes: > It remains possible that Alexander vaporized his blog not because he thought it would force Metz’s hand but because he feared that a Times reporter wouldn’t have to poke around for very long to turn up a creditable reason for negative coverage. The reporter is unaware that the Internet Archive exists? The content is obviously still readily available, so the reporter is either…

[deleted]

Re: Slate Star Codex and Silicon Valley’s War Against the Media

#196
post #187
post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

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He was pointing to the appropriate channel for reporting such an issue. How else do you think people can signal objections? At least not by writing in their own diaries for sure.

Suppose I have a big following. Suppose I know that some of those followers are prone to exaggerating some things that I "suggest". If you know those two facts, would you have written the same letter?

I'm not saying your interpretation is incorrect. I'm saying, knowing what I know about SSC, I know that certain people would interpret his letter differently and cause problems for the editor and the original jouranlist and that seems to be exactly what happened. A vocal minority took up his cause and shaped the discourse around him being a victim and the editor and journalist being evil.

Even in this thread, any kind of actual discussion is almost impossible. The general opinion is very skewed by very specific interpretations of Scott's persona.

Re: Slate Star Codex and Silicon Valley’s War Against the Media

#197

Not that the NYT has any business printing somebody's name who doesn't want it to be printed, but I kind of feel like he had been looking for an excuse to shut down the blog for a while - it had been a long time since any of his posts really felt inspired like they were even a year ago. This gives him an excuse to make a clean break.

> Not that the NYT has any business printing somebody's name who doesn't want it to be printed, I'm not sure it's as simple as that. Surely newspapers should be able to name Brock Turner or Donald Trump no matter how much they'd dislike that? At the very least, we'd have to be able to articulate some line that Scott Alexander was on the other side of.

There is no public interest rationale for exposing Scott Alexander's identity.

Re: Slate Star Codex and Silicon Valley’s War Against the Media

#198
post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"It’s not like he went to the greatest of lengths to hide his identity, Bay Area psychiatrists named Scott is a pretty small pool of people." This is a misunderstanding. He was not trying to prevent "Scott Alexander" -> real name inferences. He was only trying to limit the rate of incidental inferences in the other direction; the primary effect of greatly increasing that rate is to harm his professional life.

That seems at best a very narrow sense of "doxxing." If his name is for all practical purposes already public, and he just does not want readers of a specific newspaper to see his name mentioned, does that really count as "doxxing?"

At that point, it sounds like this is essentially about maintaining SEO for his name rather than what I would consider "doxxing".

Re: Slate Star Codex and Silicon Valley’s War Against the Media

#199
post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> NYT "isn't about clicks" while most of the news industry is drowning. No need to generalize from the state of the media as an industry; NYT is a public company so their balance sheet is public. Here's their latest 10-Q, doesn't look like drowning to me. https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/0000071691/000007169...

I said I was lazy, didn't I? :) Feel free to ignore that item. … But actually… that sheet also says that $51 million of their revenue is from digital advertising, down from $55.5 million a year ago. It's 11.5% of their total revenue, down from 12.7%. Not a huge problem but… it's still a business consideration. And let's not forget zest and sensationalism can sell subscriptions and print media too. (Publishing the ful…

Ad revenue is down but subscriptions and total revenue are up -- so doesn't that go counter to the "did it for clicks" narrative? My (admittedly simple) model of the media industry is that clickbait drives ad revenue, quality journalism drives subscriptions.

Re: Slate Star Codex and Silicon Valley’s War Against the Media

#200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> ad-hominems That's not what an ad hominem is. The word you're looking for is "insult".

you're the 3rd reply saying this so I don't have much hope of fighting the crowd, but, this is pretty much as ad hominem as it gets. The reasoning provides two and only two options for which flaw the speaker exhibits as evidence for the argument

"You are a bad person, therefore you are argument is wrong" is an ad-hominem.

"Your argument is wrong, therefore you are a bad person" is not.

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