Slate Star Codex and Silicon Valley’s War Against the Media • Hacker News Board

Re: Slate Star Codex and Silicon Valley’s War Against the Media

#121

Post by throwawaysea » Thu, Jul 09, 2020, 5:31 PM UTC

TeaDrunk wrote: post #25

seibelj wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the Harper's letter[0] being viciously attacked on the left is what's hilarious. There are no conservatives remaining in the left media, so they have to find new enemies among each other. This is textbook witch hunt / McCarthyism stuff. I just keep eating popcorn and watching it unfold! [0] https://harpers.org/a-letter-on-justice-and-open-debate/

I don't understand why it's necessary to bring this up or its relation at all with SSC or the New Yorker piece.

I am speculating on behalf of GP, but I think the reason it might be relevant is because the New Yorker has a far-left bias (https://www.allsides.com/media-bias/media-bias-chart) and the motivation to go after SSC in the first place (for some on the left) seems to be that SSC's author and comments on SSC were willing to hold objective conversations about race and other touchy matters that the far left often dismisses as off limits (for instance using the label of "scientific racism"). This Harper's letter is in support of open debate, free inquiry, and free thought, and therefore it is in effect in support of SSC.

Free thought and free inquiry and the freedom to research/discuss/publish unpopular ideas has been a hot topic in recent times. For instance, see the protest of Omar Wasow's paper on protesting (https://www.chronicle.com/article/The-Protesting-of-a-Protes...) or the firing of Steven Hsu (https://quillette.com/2020/07/01/on-steve-hsu-and-the-campai...).

Re: Slate Star Codex and Silicon Valley’s War Against the Media

#122

Post by agentdrtran » Thu, Jul 09, 2020, 5:31 PM UTC

stinkytaco wrote: post #35

wwright wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Could you point me to an era of journalism where it wasn't largely used to condemn certain figures over their words or actions?

Largely used? A scan through my local paper, and frankly most of my experience, is that journalism is largely used to report the news. I'm not going to wade in on the moral debate here, but I count among the new stories in the first few pages today: 3 stories about a major storm that came through last night 1 story about changes to unemployment rules 1 story about a major conference being canceled due to travel restr…

Local papers have had their already low budgets gutted and do not have the resources for in-depth investigative reporting.

Re: Slate Star Codex and Silicon Valley’s War Against the Media

#123

Post by memexy » Thu, Jul 09, 2020, 5:31 PM UTC

zozbot234 wrote: post #117

memexy wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

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> If you read his last letter he clearly intended to rile up his followers into a frenzy and get them to attack the reporter Um, unless you think Scott lied about what the reporter said, this is not a very sensible take. The blog takedown page reads like a factual account of what happened, and a request to direct any criticism towards the NYT's editors through the proper channels. He has never called for a mad frenzy…

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Re: Slate Star Codex and Silicon Valley’s War Against the Media

#124

Post by zozbot234 » Thu, Jul 09, 2020, 5:31 PM UTC

baddox wrote: post #104

whatshisface wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Reading the Scott Aaronson affair described as being about the trouble of male nerds on the "dating market," was awfully ugly. Of course, this doesn't mean that the New Yorker has it out for "rationalists," it's just an example of the callous and not-exactly right coverage that subcultures usually get from the mainstream. The truth is that the Aaronson affair was that he had crippling anxiety when he was young, got m…

It seems to me that simplifying the entire Scott Aaronson affair was necessary, since it was just a brief part of this article. I thought their choice of simplification was reasonable and in good faith, but of course others might disagree (and unfortunately, whether we agree or disagree is likely to be effected by our overall level of agreement with the article).

You can simplify, and then you can say Scott wrote an angry "screed" that misrepresents 99% of feminists and ignores the plight of vulnerable women in its bourgeois defense of the privileged, nerdy intellectual class. (The article doesn't actually say "bourgeois", but the dogwhistles are crystal-clear.)

Re: Slate Star Codex and Silicon Valley’s War Against the Media

#125

Post by rachelshu » Thu, Jul 09, 2020, 5:31 PM UTC

For all the other reasons that people on this site might hate this article, nevertheless it succeeds in doing the one thing that Scott asked of journalists: that they respect his pseudonym.

Re: Slate Star Codex and Silicon Valley’s War Against the Media

#126

Post by seemslegit » Thu, Jul 09, 2020, 5:32 PM UTC

> The mind-set of logical serenity, for all of the rationalists’ talk of “skin in the game” and their inclination to heighten every argument with a proposition bet, only obtains as long as their discussions feel safely confined to the realm of what they regard, consciously or otherwise, as sport.

Contrast and compare with the New Yorker writers and readership who regard their own high-minded observational detachment as art, consciously or otherwise.

Re: Slate Star Codex and Silicon Valley’s War Against the Media

#127

Post by adventured » Thu, Jul 09, 2020, 5:32 PM UTC

DubiousPusher wrote: post #112

modeless wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Banksy's identity is right on his Wikipedia page for anyone who really wants to know. I think NYT and other media are keeping him "anonymous" by way of asking. They could easily publish his name if they wanted. Unlike SSC, Banksy seems to hold similar political views to NYT, so they have no problem playing along. The only truly anonymous public figure I'm aware of is Satoshi Nakamoto and I'm pretty sure that the only…

> Banksy seems to hold similar political views to NYT, so they have no problem playing along. Genuinely curious of your basis for this. As far as I can tell SSC and most rationalist adjacents are basically neo-libs which the NYT has been a bastion of for decades.

> and most rationalist adjacents are basically neo-libs which the NYT has been a bastion of for decades.

That New York Times no longer exists and hasn't for well over a decade.

Re: Slate Star Codex and Silicon Valley’s War Against the Media

#128

Post by throwawaysea » Thu, Jul 09, 2020, 5:33 PM UTC

samirillian wrote: post #44

Am I the only one who feels like this is just posturing on both sides? SSC seems to want both fame and anonymity. The New York Times calling him controversial is more self fulfilling prophecy than truth. Both sides seem pretty absurd.

I don't see the want of both fame and anonymity as being at odds with each other. For example, take Wikileaks.

Re: Slate Star Codex and Silicon Valley’s War Against the Media

#129

Post by baddox » Thu, Jul 09, 2020, 5:33 PM UTC

chrchang523 wrote: post #70

dondawest wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m genuinely surprised that getting doxxed wasn’t part of his playbook. It’s not like he went to the greatest of lengths to hide his identity, Bay Area psychiatrists named Scott is a pretty small pool of people. This is pure speculation but my hunch is that the Scott Alexander of a few years ago wouldn’t care about being doxxed. I agree with your take on this. Become a well known writer on the internet and doom your…

"It’s not like he went to the greatest of lengths to hide his identity, Bay Area psychiatrists named Scott is a pretty small pool of people." This is a misunderstanding. He was not trying to prevent "Scott Alexander" -> real name inferences. He was only trying to limit the rate of incidental inferences in the other direction; the primary effect of greatly increasing that rate is to harm his professional life.

That seems at best a very narrow sense of "doxxing." If his name is for all practical purposes already public, and he just does not want readers of a specific newspaper to see his name mentioned, does that really count as "doxxing?"

Re: Slate Star Codex and Silicon Valley’s War Against the Media

#130

Post by TulliusCicero » Thu, Jul 09, 2020, 5:34 PM UTC

analyte123 wrote: post #109

tripletao wrote: post #28

What an ugly article. A couple quotes: > It remains possible that Alexander vaporized his blog not because he thought it would force Metz’s hand but because he feared that a Times reporter wouldn’t have to poke around for very long to turn up a creditable reason for negative coverage. The reporter is unaware that the Internet Archive exists? The content is obviously still readily available, so the reporter is either…

Parts of this read as a smoothed-over hit piece. An honest and comprehensive effort to rip apart and debunk neo-reactionary ideology is painted guilt-by-association style as "possibly legitimizing" or "describing" it. "[Exploring] and [upholding] research into innate biological differences between men and women" is "[giving] safe harbor to some genuinely egregious ideas". Asking people to politely contact the editor…

It's this, exactly. The author is clearly reaching to paint fairly innocuous actions in the most damning light possible.