One thing I've always wondered about these delivery/rideshare "experiences": why didn't they just sell the software on a subscription service? Like a shopify or slack or something. Why did they also have to replace the drivers? Aside from being suspicious labor wise, it seems like a bloated way for software engineers to start a business, especially because they don't know how labor works for taxi fleets/ restaurants across the globe. Why not just make the businesses your customers instead of the end users?
Portland approves 10% cap on fees that food delivery apps can charge restaurants
271–280 of 580 posts
Re: Portland approves 10% cap on fees that food delivery apps can charge restaurants
#272This reminds me of Ticketmaster vs. Pearl Jam in the 90s where the band exposed that Ticketmaster takes a much bigger cut that ticket holders didn't see in addition to a small 'ticket fee' that the ticket holder did see. I remember during that time that the general consensus from music fans was that Ticketmaster was an evil and greedy company. Restaurant customers really need to change their perceptions and understan…
When I hear things like, "many will not return for a long time, if ever" I think about forests and how wildfires are ultimately a Good Thing® for clearing out crowded ecosystems and paving the way for new growth.
I'm too ignorant of all the moving parts to confidently make that analogy, but I can't help but wonder if this sort of collapse could be a net positive thing. I think there are opportunities here for all the participants, even if some of the incumbents will not survive.
Re: Portland approves 10% cap on fees that food delivery apps can charge restaurants
#273Earlier quoted context omitted.
I think you misunderstand. There are a number of restaurants listed on Yelp in my area for whom the phone number listed is answered by GrubHub. I refuse to deal with GrubHub, so I make an effort to search for a direct number, but it is often difficult to find. I'm not sure how GrubHub is getting themselves set as the primary number for restaurants in Yelp, but it's happening.
The solution to that is using google maps or Apple Maps or duck duck go or a phone book. If people don’t understand that a middleman adds cost as an adult, then that is an education issue.
"The solution is high-resistance individual actions to address a situation with no societal benefit created by a company with more money than you can even begin to visualize."
This is the sort of thing one says to either feel very, very clever about themselves or because they don't want things fixed. Which is it?
Re: Portland approves 10% cap on fees that food delivery apps can charge restaurants
#274They should charge a fee based on how efficiently the restaurant gets the food to the delivery driver, because having the driver spend 20 minutes parking and waiting in line is probably why delivery is so expensive but that delivery person's wasted time doesn't otherwise cost the restaurant much.
With a normal uber ride you have to walk out to the curb to meet the driver, who does not have to find somewhere to park. If they brought the orders out to the curb like when an uber arrives rather than having drivers park & wait maybe that would make delivery far less expensive.
Re: Portland approves 10% cap on fees that food delivery apps can charge restaurants
#275Earlier quoted context omitted.
> The End game is to be the dominant food ordering platform in any given town where you get to dictate rates like 25%. You fight back by calling your order in and having them deliver it or pick it up yourself. I do this 99%* of the time as I refuse to pay a web server $8+ order+delivery fee for a meal that costs the same. It's absurd to think that people are so lazy that they cant pick up a phone or walk a few blocks…
Many of these platforms charge a fee for phone calls to the restaurant too. Platforms like Seamless go so far as to set up websites for restaurants (that often have better SEO than the restaurant's original website), so the phone number listed routes through Seamless, helping to ensure they get their cut of any order.
Then it seems like a good legal remedy might involve labeling requirements for advertising by third-parties?
This cap... is not that.
Re: Portland approves 10% cap on fees that food delivery apps can charge restaurants
#276IMO this is misguided. The reason that restaurants are struggling is because they're unable to provide the value they once did, but they're still bearing a lot of the costs that used to provide it.
All of these restaurants are paying rent on their dining rooms, when they're only using the kitchens. The customer experience, paid for by waiter wages and dining room rent, is now being provided by the delivery companies. The whole customer interaction, from taking the order, to processing the payment to bringing the food to the customer has been taken over by the delivery companies, and that's a huge part of the cost and the value of the meal.
Restaurants can't reasonably expect the delivery companies to just eat all of their substantial costs because the Restaurant has a stranded asset that used to provide that service. Really, it should be the landlords that are taking the hit because all of that prime dining space now has the same value as some tiny cloud kitchen off a back alley.
Re: Portland approves 10% cap on fees that food delivery apps can charge restaurants
#277Earlier quoted context omitted.
How about you have to charge the fee to the customer. The issue isn't taking 25%. It's taking 25% from the restaurant, which means they don't have a profit margin left. If for example the pizza is $10 at the restaurant, make that $12.50 with delivery and $10 without. That way the consumer can decide themselves if they want to pay the added amount for delivery, or if they'd rather walk/drive. Right now they charge you…
It's already 12.5$ with delivery. And even worse, a ton of other fees get added on top of it, making your order total close to 18$. Consumers are already paying enough, so they don't want to pay more. This is the reason why the Apps turn to restaurants instead. Even with that, they aren't still profitable.
Then they should cease being in business.
Re: Portland approves 10% cap on fees that food delivery apps can charge restaurants
#278Next week there will be complaints that food delivery services are no longer catering to certain areas. Instead of accepting that it is just not profitable for them, journalists will label it as backslash or an act of punishment. Same thing happened in others states/cities that implemented similar rules. The winners are people living in central areas of the city with lots of restaurants. The losers are the poorer out…
If food delivery services suspend service in Portland tomorrow, I would find it pretty hard to believe it isn't political maneuvering to prevent other localities from doing the same.
Re: Portland approves 10% cap on fees that food delivery apps can charge restaurants
#279This is a regulatory response to Silicon Valley’s implementation of predatory pricing. Let me explain: Predatory pricing is defined as “the pricing of goods or services at such a low level that other suppliers cannot compete and are forced to leave the market.” For silicon valley startups like Doordash and Grubhub this is accomplished by acquiring customers at a significant loss in ways that may often seem idiotic. e…
The problem is that this response is in the wrong direction. By forcing prices lower, we guarantee that only over-capitalized predatory businesses can compete in the space. The problem is that consumer advocacy and anti-monopoly are practically the opposite thing. The end result of government action here should be short-term higher prices to the consumer, that reflect the actual cost of operations, rather than lower…
Isn't the 10% cap making the end game of monopoly and higher prices impossible though?
Re: Portland approves 10% cap on fees that food delivery apps can charge restaurants
#280Earlier quoted context omitted.
The solution to that is using google maps or Apple Maps or duck duck go or a phone book. If people don’t understand that a middleman adds cost as an adult, then that is an education issue.
> The solution to that is using google maps or Apple Maps or duck duck go or a phone book. You can try. https://www.yelp-support.com/article/How-did-the-information... > Yelp provides Apple with access to some of our business page information
Yelp also provides DDG results.