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The stable marriage problem and modern dating

arvarik.com

61–70 of 224 posts

Re: The stable marriage problem and modern dating

#61
post #6

Some interesting stuff there. I think you could also frame it as a explore vs exploit problem. If we assume there is a successive series of partners you could meet but only in sequence and you choose whether to "attempt to exploit, i.e. form a relationship" or pass and continue to explore. At which point should you commit such that it maximizes the expected gain (marginalizing over your lifespan)? It's like RL game e…

What you describe is called the "secretary problem", among other names https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Secretary_problem

I was trying to explain this to a friend playing Animal Crossing. I did not get very far.

Optimality breaks down when humans get involved. Because what most humans need is to believe they did a good job picking, which is quite a bit different. If the best solution falls into your lap you may continue spending energy on that decision forever, and that longing for what might have been is a big opportunity cost (which is magnified if your partner ever finds out about it). We have this sort of intuition that we have to put a bit of sweat equity into a decision before it feels good. Which may relate to the somewhat debunked theory of 'ego exhaustion'.

You may know what fridge you want but you have to keep showing options to your spouse because they aren't okay with the decision yet, and if you rush it then you'll regret it. You can spend that energy now, or you can make emotional interest payments for the life of the fridge. At work you sometimes have to do the wrong thing so that people get why the more expensive option makes sense.

What my friend was doing and what I see other people do, including myself, is make a list of targets of opportunity. 5% of the options are acceptable and I will stop when I get access to the first one in that category, be it a fridge, an islander, or a partner. This person is smart, funny, likes cats, and your family adores them, and you have chemistry so why not. You feel good with your decision, or at least you do at the time. You might still leave them six years later because it turns out those other things you didn't like overshadowed everything else, once you had to live in the same house. How many other potential matches went away during that time?

Re: The stable marriage problem and modern dating

#62
post #40

Having worked on a dating app startup with a 2m seed (it's since pivoted to a brewery run by active gang members), I can say the problem of dating is looked at horribly wrong. People assume dating is about finding the person "most compatible" with you. Compatibility is an illusion. Most people tend to date until they have an idea of "what they don't want". Once they know and they find someone who checks the boxes, th…

Do you have any data to back that up that you can share? I don't mean to call you out, it could very well be the case, people date in rather not-understandable ways to me. What you're saying does not match my experience though. Quite a few friends of mine have dated only very few people before getting married. Anecdotally, the marriages that seem to do the best are the marriages in which both partners did not have a…

> I'm aware of the negative selection bias there

I'm guessing those marriages are likely correlated with strong shared religious beliefs[1] and closeness to extended families that help share the burden of raising children.

[1] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2857783/#:~:tex....

Re: The stable marriage problem and modern dating

#63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm always surprised that while men apparently rate women's attractiveness on a bell curve, women seem to rate men on a Pareto distribution. Considering how much I hear about beauty standards and how they harm women, I almost never hear anything about male beauty standards. If society is to be improved by having more realistic female beauty standards, then there's apparently a lot more headroom for society to be impr…

Unrealistic beauty standards are absolutely a problem for both men and women, the difference is that in society, men can be valued for other things (occupation, knowledge, athletics) and that is much less true for women.

That's fair but it's not a zero sum game. Making men happier on average doesn't necessarily make women unhappier.

Re: The stable marriage problem and modern dating

#64
post #40

Having worked on a dating app startup with a 2m seed (it's since pivoted to a brewery run by active gang members), I can say the problem of dating is looked at horribly wrong. People assume dating is about finding the person "most compatible" with you. Compatibility is an illusion. Most people tend to date until they have an idea of "what they don't want". Once they know and they find someone who checks the boxes, th…

Do you have any data to back that up that you can share? I don't mean to call you out, it could very well be the case, people date in rather not-understandable ways to me. What you're saying does not match my experience though. Quite a few friends of mine have dated only very few people before getting married. Anecdotally, the marriages that seem to do the best are the marriages in which both partners did not have a…

[deleted]

Re: The stable marriage problem and modern dating

#65
post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you have any data to back that up that you can share? I don't mean to call you out, it could very well be the case, people date in rather not-understandable ways to me. What you're saying does not match my experience though. Quite a few friends of mine have dated only very few people before getting married. Anecdotally, the marriages that seem to do the best are the marriages in which both partners did not have a…

Because long term marriage is a lot about your tendency to create long term emotional ties to people. It is also about your willingness to think about relationship itself and put work on it. It is also about selection, but much more about ability to weed out abusive people and selfish people and so on. Of course also compatibility, clean freak will never be happy with messy person. And those abilities form a lot in c…

Those abilities are trainable, especially with therapy.

Re: The stable marriage problem and modern dating

#66

One factor that I didn't see addressed in the post which does make a significant impact is that men in general rate women more similarly than women rate men. See for example: https://www.marketingcharts.com/demographics-and-audiences/m... As such, male advantage is probably a lot lower in the real world, if (hyperbolic) every woman has a different man on nr 1 of their preference list, and every man has the same woman…

I'm always surprised that while men apparently rate women's attractiveness on a bell curve, women seem to rate men on a Pareto distribution. Considering how much I hear about beauty standards and how they harm women, I almost never hear anything about male beauty standards. If society is to be improved by having more realistic female beauty standards, then there's apparently a lot more headroom for society to be impr…

It's not like it's terribly hard to rationalize. Women, being the ones bearing the children, are probably better-served by being more picky.

Re: The stable marriage problem and modern dating

#68
Schopenhauer believed that we can't control who we are attracted to, nature does, and further that the mates nature predisposes us to aren't the one most likely to make us happy, it's the ones most likely to produce genetically compatible offspring.

"Love... casts itself on persons who, apart from the sexual relation, would be hateful, contemptible and even abhorrent to the lover. But the will of the species is so much more powerful than that of the individual, that the lover shuts his eyes to all the qualities repugnant to him... Only from this is it possible to explain why we often see very rational, and even eminent, men tied to termagants and matrimonial fiends..."

Re: The stable marriage problem and modern dating

#69
post #15

"the top 20% of men hold 80% of cumulative attractiveness in the eyes of women" - OKCupid stats As a guy who lives polyamorous, this is an interesting observation. Many guys told me that they try the poly life, because if they don't have to be "the one" for a women, their potential partners would give them a chance even if they aren't a 100% fit. Somehow, only a few guys end up with multiple women.

definitely see this in my scene. the most attractive guys have many partners while the lesser ones don't have that many. more attractive guys are fought over and rifts are created because of it. It's really funny because a lot of them consider themselves anarchists politically...yet the few attractive men seem to dominate.

I wonder how much of this is perception vs. reality. Many women trip over themselves around me, but I'm monogamous and have only chosen to be in a couple of relationships because finding a match is really hard. Just because someone gets a lot of attention, that doesn't mean they're going around having endless casual sex or unlimited girlfriends.

Re: The stable marriage problem and modern dating

#70
post #16

>> The first graph demonstrates the O(n²) complexity of the algorithm. We can see that as the community grows larger, even by a small amount, the amount of iterations it takes to solve the matching problem grows exponentially. This statement is contradictory. Probably the author is using "exponentially" to mean quick growth. I suppose this is alright in common parlance, but I find it disturbing when people describe a…

Whenever I visit family in the midwest this phenomenon makes me twitch. It seems people out there have taken to using "exponentially" as a pseudo-scientific word meaning "a lot". i.e. "you're making my job exponentially more difficult" Edit: fixed typo :)

This bothers me to no end too. But I’ve given up in every trying to fix it, it’s entered the public lexicon, if you want to talk about actual exponential growth you need to be more specific now.
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