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Hong Kong: books by pro-democracy activists disappear from library shelves

theguardian.com

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Re: Hong Kong: books by pro-democracy activists disappear from library shelves

#91

Post by DangitBobby »

magicsmoke wrote: post #50
chadcmulligan wrote: post #12

How is it that many Chinese students are schooled in the west, and have access to all these books and thoughts, but then they don't exist when they go back home. There must be some significant cognitive dissonance between the two situations. I don't see how they can keep a lid on this long term.

It's hard to reconcile the words in a textbook that says an authoritarian society is doomed to fail, then go home and watch rice paddies turn to skyscrapers in a generation. In a competition between academia and the real world, the real world always wins out.

I don't remember reading that in any textbook. I'm not sure potential failure is the problem we've been taught to have with authoritarianism.

Re: Hong Kong: books by pro-democracy activists disappear from library shelves

#92

Post by chadcmulligan »

magicsmoke wrote: post #50
chadcmulligan wrote: post #12

How is it that many Chinese students are schooled in the west, and have access to all these books and thoughts, but then they don't exist when they go back home. There must be some significant cognitive dissonance between the two situations. I don't see how they can keep a lid on this long term.

It's hard to reconcile the words in a textbook that says an authoritarian society is doomed to fail, then go home and watch rice paddies turn to skyscrapers in a generation. In a competition between academia and the real world, the real world always wins out.

Your comments are interesting (in this and other threads), as others have mentioned - authoritarian societies are good for those in authority - less so for the others. If the authoritarian society is so good, why is it necessary to disallow conversation? Surely if everyone was doing well, conversation would be encouraged - because everyone would be saying how well things are going. The assumption of any reasonable person is, that if conversation and dissent is not allowed then there must be a reason, otherwise what are they scared of?

Re: Hong Kong: books by pro-democracy activists disappear from library shelves

#93

Post by ttul »

eloff wrote: post #11

It was very clever of China to tighten their grip on Hong Kong while the world is distracted with the pandemic, and the US is further distracted with its own issues. Well played. I hope it backfires on them.

This is one part of a several act drama that is playing out for the home audience. Reign in the disobedient teenager (Hong Kong) by taking his skateboard away. Act two is a military provocation, which is why the US has moved more hardware into the area.

Re: Hong Kong: books by pro-democracy activists disappear from library shelves

#95

Post by vixen99 »

eloff wrote: post #11

It was very clever of China to tighten their grip on Hong Kong while the world is distracted with the pandemic, and the US is further distracted with its own issues. Well played. I hope it backfires on them.

Was it so clever? Hasn't this event encouraged a shift to a radically altered climate of opinion among many with regard to China (as CCCP)? Seems this is already having consequences.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2020/07/04/hsbc-faces-c...

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/u-k-may-phase-out-huawe...

Re: Hong Kong: books by pro-democracy activists disappear from library shelves

#96

Post by a9h74j »

hkt wrote: post #30
jpgreens wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is not surprising at all. BLM is a neomarxist movement which is ideologically aligned with the CCP. The fact that all these companies are expressing support for BLM is absolutely terrifying and shows how much power this new neomarxist movement has.

I don't think wanting black people to not get regularly murdered by the police is marxism, per se. Neither is being against celebrating slavers etc. Claiming the CCP and BLM are on the same page would be comical if I wasn't so sure you were serious.

I don't know what the referenced claim was, but typing "blm trained marxist" into ddg gives a page of confirming links.

“We’re trained Marxists.” - Patrisse Cullors, BLM Co-Founder https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HgEUbSzOTZ8 (1.5 min video in her own words)

In the UK the veil has started to lift. BLM-the-organizations are increasingly recognized as anti-capitalist, again based in their own words.

Re: Hong Kong: books by pro-democracy activists disappear from library shelves

#98

Post by chadcmulligan »

Ericson2314 wrote: post #85
hkt wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I imagine the effects will take some time to filter through, but yeah, a generation of the Chinese elite being schooled in the west seems likely to have a pretty profound impact. I suppose this is part of the west's gambit in being so open to international students generally. On the other hand, the Chinese community at universities in my city includes many who don't speak English or try to interact with the locals. T…

The British and German elite also intermingled because the world wars, it's not enough. Basically, if the masses don't know about the either country, and the elites are tempted by power (it's nicer to make the propaganda than receive it, plus their economic prospects are better in China) and knowing they don't have to fight in wars themselves, it's not good enough. Also, as much as I truly believe in the west's value…

There are other democracies besides the US, and they're all doing fine in general. Our PM recently pointed out in a speech [1], that maybe the US couldn't beat them alone, but Aus, Japan, Phillipines, India, Indonesia, Korea and the US could probably have a good shot at it, all countries China is picking fights with, not that I think its likely, just saber rattling - there's no profit for China in a war, just loss of customers.

[1] https://www.news.com.au/technology/innovation/military/we-wi...

Edit: personally I think it more likely they'll just raise the bamboo curtain again - they don't seem very interested in any sort of cultural interchange.

Re: Hong Kong: books by pro-democracy activists disappear from library shelves

#99

Post by chvid »

corey_moncure wrote: post #75
iforgotpassword wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because they see things from a completely different angle, different cultural background, and obviously pre-seeded with what the CCP wants them to see as the truth. Because really, consider in how many ways the west does not practice what it preaches. Look at how big corporations abuse capitalism, work against customer rights through lobbying. Look at the whole "right to repair" debate. There is plenty of stuff you c…

Speaking as charitably as possible, comments like these indicate to me that the poster has never been to China and has no idea about the actual conditions there. If you just step outside the select few favored economic zones you will see a very different, much lower, standard of living that accounts for the vast majority of the land area. Granted the last time I was there was about eight years ago, but taking a bus f…

What videos are you referring to?

Re: Hong Kong: books by pro-democracy activists disappear from library shelves

#100

Post by mrobot »

Important to note that the US Agency for Global Media was funding and supporting the Hong Kong protests [1]. China could never get away with doing the same thing in the US.

The fact is that media bubbles are a powerful tool. There is a reason the US / CIA spend so much time/money on projects like Radio Free Asia. If you are on the same side as the CIA and US imperialism, you might want to think about why that is and what kind of harm you are causing with your jingoistic posts. The US media is carefully controlled and an opinion-making bubble of its own. Yes, many Chinese people support their government and it's not because they are duped, actually.

[1] https://www.scmp.com/comment/opinion/article/3091438/us-has-...

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