Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

The Fourth of July

popehat.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

81–90 of 324 posts

Re: The Fourth of July

#81

Post by jonathannat »

c3534l wrote: post #72

Given this introduction: > I've re-posted this many times, because it's fundamental to what it means to me to be an American. I was thinking I was in for something uplifting. Instead I got: > In 1946, Congress reneged on FDR's promise. Filipino solders who fought for us and their families were not given their promised citizenship, let alone benefits. ... They waited 44 years, until after most of them were dead. This…

I think the moral of the story is that America is flawed, however, it eventually does the right thing, as well as other great things. And that's why it engenders so much love/hate.

I think it's very relevant to today's events, where people wants to "cancel" a person, just because of one or two things they did wrong (which may have just been the norm in their days). This is a slightly disturbing trends, as we can supposedly only use perfectionists and saints as role models (are there any?), instead of humans who are naturally flawed.

I am proud of America, the country that produced a great democracy, defeated Nazi Germany - which raised hell on earth and held concentration camps, sent people to the moon, heralded in 70 years of relative peace, spread democracies around the world, launched reusable rockets that landed back safely, and is in the process of confronting China - another country that raised hell on earth and held concentration camps - after realizing its fault.

Re: The Fourth of July

#82

Post by deeg »

c3534l wrote: post #72

Given this introduction: > I've re-posted this many times, because it's fundamental to what it means to me to be an American. I was thinking I was in for something uplifting. Instead I got: > In 1946, Congress reneged on FDR's promise. Filipino solders who fought for us and their families were not given their promised citizenship, let alone benefits. ... They waited 44 years, until after most of them were dead. This…

You aren't wrong. There were probably some veterans who were too bitter to accept the late grant of citizenship.

The government finally made the step forward--apallingly late--but it's still a step forward. Let's make sure we keep taking those steps.

Re: The Fourth of July

#83

Post by verroq »

c3534l wrote: post #72

Given this introduction: > I've re-posted this many times, because it's fundamental to what it means to me to be an American. I was thinking I was in for something uplifting. Instead I got: > In 1946, Congress reneged on FDR's promise. Filipino solders who fought for us and their families were not given their promised citizenship, let alone benefits. ... They waited 44 years, until after most of them were dead. This…

America eventually doing the right thing is America at its worst? Why so much self-hatred?

Re: The Fourth of July

#84

Post by refurb »

c3534l wrote: post #72

Given this introduction: > I've re-posted this many times, because it's fundamental to what it means to me to be an American. I was thinking I was in for something uplifting. Instead I got: > In 1946, Congress reneged on FDR's promise. Filipino solders who fought for us and their families were not given their promised citizenship, let alone benefits. ... They waited 44 years, until after most of them were dead. This…

If your standard for a country is perfection, you're going to be sorely disappointed, again and again.

And in fact, I can guarantee you that you hold opinions today that will be looked up with disgust by people in 100 years.

Re: The Fourth of July

#85

Post by c3534l »

rayiner wrote: post #77
c3534l wrote: post #72

Given this introduction: > I've re-posted this many times, because it's fundamental to what it means to me to be an American. I was thinking I was in for something uplifting. Instead I got: > In 1946, Congress reneged on FDR's promise. Filipino solders who fought for us and their families were not given their promised citizenship, let alone benefits. ... They waited 44 years, until after most of them were dead. This…

This story isn’t about Truman and the other people who reneged on the promise in 1946–who were all dead by 1992. That’s a very self-centered way to look at this. This is a story about immigrants who loved America so much that they proudly accepted citizenship when it was belatedly conferred to them. What kind of country engenders such love and devotion even in the face of such slights?

Its great that they didn't hold a grudge, but I don't see why I should be moved by it. Of course they were happy, they were finally being given what they were promised. A prisoner being exonerated of a crime they were falsely accused would probably be ecstatic, but hearing the story of someone being falsely convicted hardly engenders feelings of pride in our justice system. I don't see why it should be different in this case. There was no uplifting story about how someone managed to change immigration by fighting for what he believed or anything like that. The story was just "we backstabbed you and 44 years they were happy when we finally removed the knife. Yay us!" I can't muster any positive emotions in this story. I can't see why anyone would feel proud of this.

Re: The Fourth of July

#86

Post by refurb »

weiming wrote: post #42
myrandomcomment wrote: post #2

As a father, a husband, a former soldier and an American, this brings a tear to my eye. “We are not enemies, but friends. We must not be enemies. Though passion may have strained, it must not break our bonds of affection. The mystic chords of memory will swell when again touched, as surely they will be, by the better angels of our nature.” - Lincoln As an American I feel we are bound not by our failures of past moral…

What me and my family talked about today is that, as immigrants, we are so sad how much the "native born" people of the US hate their own country. They seem to never waste an opportunity to remind others of their disdain and it is more and more visible these days e.g. in big news media or on Twitter. Makes me sad and I hope this can change.

As an immigrant the US I feel the exact same way. American don't know how good they have it compared to a lot of the world.

Re: The Fourth of July

#87

Post by EdwardDiego »

hintymad wrote: post #63
weiming wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What me and my family talked about today is that, as immigrants, we are so sad how much the "native born" people of the US hate their own country. They seem to never waste an opportunity to remind others of their disdain and it is more and more visible these days e.g. in big news media or on Twitter. Makes me sad and I hope this can change.

Yeah, and so many people of color came to the US with a suite case and less than $1000 dollars, and then became a successful person in a few years. I certainly did. My wife certainly did. My team, my gardener, and my contractor certainly did. Some people who are from the same school as I went to have even become CEOs of big companies, and some have become famous professors or head of prestigious universities. If anyt…

When writing this, did you consider that most African Americans are descended from people who didn't get to bring a suitcase? That they were still fighting to be treated as equal citizens a century and a half after no longer being considered property?

And that the fact that they're over-represented in basketball doesn't mean that inequality is solved?

Re: The Fourth of July

#88

Post by refurb »

hintymad wrote: post #63
weiming wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What me and my family talked about today is that, as immigrants, we are so sad how much the "native born" people of the US hate their own country. They seem to never waste an opportunity to remind others of their disdain and it is more and more visible these days e.g. in big news media or on Twitter. Makes me sad and I hope this can change.

Yeah, and so many people of color came to the US with a suite case and less than $1000 dollars, and then became a successful person in a few years. I certainly did. My wife certainly did. My team, my gardener, and my contractor certainly did. Some people who are from the same school as I went to have even become CEOs of big companies, and some have become famous professors or head of prestigious universities. If anyt…

Similarly, my wife's family came from an oppressive SE Asia country. One of them escaped on a boat and spent 3 years in a refugee camp in a country that refused to admit them. They eventually made it to the US and survived on nothing but the generosity of Americans.

They are now firmly upper-middle class and consider the US as truly the land of opportunity and are grateful they had the chance to come here.

Re: The Fourth of July

#89

Post by pjungwir »

radley wrote: post #16
ed25519FUUU wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seeing a statue of Lincoln defaced made me more sad than almost any of the other. If we can’t look to people like Lincoln as our heroes, then what type of hero do we really want?

The defaced statue was a conservative media misunderstanding: We traced the photo back to the conservative website the Daily Wire, where “The Michael Knowles Show”... - https://www.factcheck.org/2020/06/statue-in-lincoln-memorial...

I don't know any Lincoln examples but here in Portland they have pulled down statues of Washington and Jefferson:

- https://twitter.com/hungrybowtie/status/1273859657447006208

- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4V29opdHt-M

Re: The Fourth of July

#90

Post by p1esk »

c3534l wrote: post #85
rayiner wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This story isn’t about Truman and the other people who reneged on the promise in 1946–who were all dead by 1992. That’s a very self-centered way to look at this. This is a story about immigrants who loved America so much that they proudly accepted citizenship when it was belatedly conferred to them. What kind of country engenders such love and devotion even in the face of such slights?

Its great that they didn't hold a grudge, but I don't see why I should be moved by it. Of course they were happy, they were finally being given what they were promised. A prisoner being exonerated of a crime they were falsely accused would probably be ecstatic, but hearing the story of someone being falsely convicted hardly engenders feelings of pride in our justice system. I don't see why it should be different in t…

Yes. Asking people to literally give their lives for you on the battlefield, promising citizenship to those who survive, then betraying them until most are dead. Not much to be proud of here, no matter how you spin it.
Post reply on HN