MS will ban Forza players who add the confederate flag to their digital cars • Hacker News Board

Re: MS will ban Forza players who add the confederate flag to their digital cars

#91

Post by cm2187 » Thu, Jul 02, 2020, 5:22 PM UTC

PragmaticPulp wrote: post #16

pathseeker wrote: post #7

Honest question. For those of you happy that these censorship policies are being implemented by companies in reaction to pressure, do you believe that the ideal end-goal would be 'anti hate speech' laws like those of Germany?

No. It’s apples and oranges. Companies should be free to regulate hate speech on their platforms. The government should not regulate speech in the public domain. The actions of private companies on private property (virtual or otherwise) are an entirely different domain than government intervention. Even if you remove the censorship angle, it can be argued that moderating hate speech is simply good business sense. Pe…

Sure, it might not violate the law. The problem with private companies trying to enforce political opinions and controlling speech on their platform is that it is pretty much the definition of McCathyism. With people losing their job over liking a tweet. I remember when the left was looking at the McCarthy period as a dark page of american history. I am appalled how quickly this went 180 degrees.

Re: MS will ban Forza players who add the confederate flag to their digital cars

#92

Post by kukx » Thu, Jul 02, 2020, 5:22 PM UTC

daenz wrote: post #62

PragmaticPulp wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No. It’s apples and oranges. Companies should be free to regulate hate speech on their platforms. The government should not regulate speech in the public domain. The actions of private companies on private property (virtual or otherwise) are an entirely different domain than government intervention. Even if you remove the censorship angle, it can be argued that moderating hate speech is simply good business sense. Pe…

>Companies should be free to regulate hate speech on their platforms. The government should not regulate speech in the public domain. While I agree, please direct me to where I can speak "in the public domain" online.

For example there is Parler, an alternative to Twitter. While it is not a state company, it promotes free speech. They claim "Our content is moderated based off the FCC and the Supreme court of the United States which enables free expression without violence and a lack of censorship.".

Re: MS will ban Forza players who add the confederate flag to their digital cars

#93

Post by mcbutterbunz » Thu, Jul 02, 2020, 5:22 PM UTC

i_am_proteus wrote: post #4

Interesting that the Japanese rising sun flag is mentioned alongside the swastika and the stars and bars; the rising sun flag remains in contemporary use by the Japanese Maritime Self Defense Force.

All meaning aside, I think the off-center rising sun flag is really cool looking.

Re: MS will ban Forza players who add the confederate flag to their digital cars

#94

Post by [deleted] » Thu, Jul 02, 2020, 5:23 PM UTC

daenz wrote: post #62

PragmaticPulp wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No. It’s apples and oranges. Companies should be free to regulate hate speech on their platforms. The government should not regulate speech in the public domain. The actions of private companies on private property (virtual or otherwise) are an entirely different domain than government intervention. Even if you remove the censorship angle, it can be argued that moderating hate speech is simply good business sense. Pe…

>Companies should be free to regulate hate speech on their platforms. The government should not regulate speech in the public domain. While I agree, please direct me to where I can speak "in the public domain" online.

[deleted]

Re: MS will ban Forza players who add the confederate flag to their digital cars

#95

Post by s9w » Thu, Jul 02, 2020, 5:23 PM UTC

iameli wrote: post #35

pathseeker wrote: post #7

Honest question. For those of you happy that these censorship policies are being implemented by companies in reaction to pressure, do you believe that the ideal end-goal would be 'anti hate speech' laws like those of Germany?

Doing so would probably require amending the First Amendment, which I think would do more harm than good. But Germany seems to have implemented such a system without becoming a dystopian hellscape. Seems a pretty nice place to live.

Try publicly criticizing government politics (especially the 2015 kind) and watch your life be "cancelled" in Germany. Dystopian hellscape comes pretty close.

Re: MS will ban Forza players who add the confederate flag to their digital cars

#96

Post by dsr_ » Thu, Jul 02, 2020, 5:23 PM UTC

daenz wrote: post #62

PragmaticPulp wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No. It’s apples and oranges. Companies should be free to regulate hate speech on their platforms. The government should not regulate speech in the public domain. The actions of private companies on private property (virtual or otherwise) are an entirely different domain than government intervention. Even if you remove the censorship angle, it can be argued that moderating hate speech is simply good business sense. Pe…

>Companies should be free to regulate hate speech on their platforms. The government should not regulate speech in the public domain. While I agree, please direct me to where I can speak "in the public domain" online.

In the US, ISPs were a common carrier from 2015 through 2017, when the Republicans revoked that: while they might not let you say anything you want on the servers they own, they couldn't terminate your contract for you saying legal things on the servers you own.

Perhaps that regulatory regime will return. Maybe even next year. Not under a Republican-led FCC, of course.

Re: MS will ban Forza players who add the confederate flag to their digital cars

#97

Post by tgv » Thu, Jul 02, 2020, 5:23 PM UTC

iameli wrote: post #35

pathseeker wrote: post #7

Honest question. For those of you happy that these censorship policies are being implemented by companies in reaction to pressure, do you believe that the ideal end-goal would be 'anti hate speech' laws like those of Germany?

Doing so would probably require amending the First Amendment, which I think would do more harm than good. But Germany seems to have implemented such a system without becoming a dystopian hellscape. Seems a pretty nice place to live.

TBH, there are a lot of other factors that make Germany a decent place. A less polarized society is one of them, a representative parliament another. IMO, it takes more than a law to keep it civilized.

Re: MS will ban Forza players who add the confederate flag to their digital cars

#98

Post by root_axis » Thu, Jul 02, 2020, 5:23 PM UTC

drocer88 wrote: post #31

What next? Tibetan flags? Uighur flags? Palestinian flags? Basque flags? Chechen flags? Israeli flags? South vietnamese flags? Taiwan flags? Dominion of Newfoundland flags? Black nationalist flags? Who's the judge?

The game publisher is the judge in this case. Not everyone will agree with the judgement of course but I don't think there is something inherently wrong with that.

Re: MS will ban Forza players who add the confederate flag to their digital cars

#99

Post by searchableguy » Thu, Jul 02, 2020, 5:23 PM UTC

s9w wrote: post #56

pathseeker wrote: post #7

Honest question. For those of you happy that these censorship policies are being implemented by companies in reaction to pressure, do you believe that the ideal end-goal would be 'anti hate speech' laws like those of Germany?

Very soon even Facebook likes will be illegal in Germany if it's the "wrong" ones by the way. That law passed a week ago or two.

Explain which law are you referring to here?

Re: MS will ban Forza players who add the confederate flag to their digital cars

#100

Post by monocasa » Thu, Jul 02, 2020, 5:23 PM UTC

gentleman11 wrote: post #52

I am not very familiar with the American civil war. The way people talk about it seems weird to me though: it is as though the entire southern United States were overcome by an irresistible race hatred and they started a war in order to ensure their white supremacy- but mostly out of ignorance of the morals of this. I have a hard time believing the entire southern United States was only fighting for the right to own…

It was very much over slavery. The entire economic system of the south depended on chattel slavery, and the south didn't really recover economically for a century.

And despite the idea of it being over the abstract idea of "states' rights", the confederate constitution mainly reduced a state's right to make choices for itself. It was pretty much a clone of the US constitution, with a clause that states couldn't ban slavery if they wanted to.