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Magic hat leaves behind a transformed craft beer industry in Vermont

sevendaysvt.com

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Re: Magic hat leaves behind a transformed craft beer industry in Vermont

#31

Post by dvtrn »

chrisseaton wrote: post #29

I think an issue the American craft beer scene has is quantity over quality. Some American beer places I go into have like forty different beers on tap , and are really proud of it. I find it hard to believe that forty beers are being kept fresh and live and maintained properly. Are they replacing them every few days or are the less popular ones in a range that wide sitting there for weeks? I feel like they're ending…

I find it hard to believe that forty beers are being kept fresh and live and maintained properly

Asked honesty and earnestly, why?

Re: Magic hat leaves behind a transformed craft beer industry in Vermont

#32

Post by chrisseaton »

dvtrn wrote: post #31
chrisseaton wrote: post #29

I think an issue the American craft beer scene has is quantity over quality. Some American beer places I go into have like forty different beers on tap , and are really proud of it. I find it hard to believe that forty beers are being kept fresh and live and maintained properly. Are they replacing them every few days or are the less popular ones in a range that wide sitting there for weeks? I feel like they're ending…

I find it hard to believe that forty beers are being kept fresh and live and maintained properly Asked honesty and earnestly, why?

Fresh beer ideally lasts about five days. Are these places getting through a whole cask of all their forty beers every five days? Doesn't seem likely to me. I'm guessing that they're using shortcuts like putting it into kegs rather than casks, Pasteurising rather than keeping it fresh, and using carbonation instead of pumping it naturally, in order to support their huuuuuuge ranges. If they focused on a smaller number they woudln't have to do this and they could have higher quality instead.

Re: Magic hat leaves behind a transformed craft beer industry in Vermont

#33

Post by andygcook »

ErikAugust wrote: post #17

Vermont today has much better beer than Magic Hat (even at its height). They tried a lot of different stuff, and most of it just wasn't very enjoyable. What Magic Hat did have was beautiful marketing and wider distribution. It has to be partially by choice, but The Alchemist and Lawson's make some of the best beer I have ever had, but they are both impossible to find outside of New England and a few parts of New York…

Vermont has phenomenal beers if you like hoppy IPAs. Besides being a very fun city, most bars in Burlington, VT carry beers from the local breweries around there: Lawson's (Sip of Sunshine), the Alchemist (Heady Topper), Fourteenth Star (Tribute), Zero Gravity, Hill Farmstead, and more.

If you ever end up in MA, Tree House is worth checking out and has 4 of the top 20 beers on Untappd right now. Vitamin Sea in Weymouth, MA is also very good if you're closer to the coast.

Re: Magic hat leaves behind a transformed craft beer industry in Vermont

#34

Post by linuxftw »

pessimizer wrote: post #18
nkozyra wrote: post #5

I think while Magic Hat holds a place in the craft beer renaissance story, much of the regional beer from that era was unremarkable. The idea that it was better than the macro beers stemmed largely from the experimentation and derivation from American adjunct lagers. As the smaller, more rabid craft beer industry grew from the late 90s, bigger regional brewers like MH never really evolved. Some of that might have bee…

I think that small breweries were caught up in the same trends that were going on in (hipster) food in general: it's easier to be incomparable than to be good. I don't know what to compare an apricot beer to, so I don't know if an apricot beer is a good apricot beer. If I'm the type of customer who is attracted to the high-concept of an apricot beer, when I get sick of it, I'm not going to find another apricot beer,…

I've tried many craft breweries all over the US. Most of the time, their beers are indistinguishable from one another, and most of the time the beer isn't very good. It's common for me to walk into a brewery and not like a single beer out of 6-15 beers. I don't consider myself a beer snob, I love lots of different types of beer. I'm a firm believer that most of the major brands of beer are big due to taste, other than the economy beers.

In many ways, beer is like pizza. The best recipes already exist. There is nothing new to create or innovate. Microbrews are like hot-pockets filled with canned tomato sauce, yak cheese and caramelized watermelon. It might be novel, but it's probably not very good.

Re: Magic hat leaves behind a transformed craft beer industry in Vermont

#35

Post by dvtrn »

chrisseaton wrote: post #32
dvtrn wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find it hard to believe that forty beers are being kept fresh and live and maintained properly Asked honesty and earnestly, why?

Fresh beer ideally lasts about five days. Are these places getting through a whole cask of all their forty beers every five days? Doesn't seem likely to me. I'm guessing that they're using shortcuts like putting it into kegs rather than casks, Pasteurising rather than keeping it fresh, and using carbonation instead of pumping it naturally, in order to support their huuuuuuge ranges. If they focused on a smaller numbe…

There are several styles of beer that can be stored such that they continue fermenting in storage and become a final, drinkable product by the time it gets connected to a tap-so this is HEAVILY dependent on what kind of beer you’re making, it’s not really applicable as a universal statement for the storage of several kinds beer. IPAs for example can last quite a long time if properly store (up to four weeks I believe?).

Beers brewed in casks obviously have a different fermentation cycle than something brewed macro systems but storage is less of a problem than you may think for brewpubs and gastropubs, generally speaking. Wits can last for a while if properly stored and rotated (physically as in turning the keg on end), for example. But even then, casks aren’t ideal for long term storage in many cases, and not all beers are suited for storage in casks as opposed to say: steel kegs.

(Spent quite a long time in the service industry and worked two large breweries in Texas)

Re: Magic hat leaves behind a transformed craft beer industry in Vermont

#36

Post by StrangeDoctor »

chrisseaton wrote: post #32
dvtrn wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find it hard to believe that forty beers are being kept fresh and live and maintained properly Asked honesty and earnestly, why?

Fresh beer ideally lasts about five days. Are these places getting through a whole cask of all their forty beers every five days? Doesn't seem likely to me. I'm guessing that they're using shortcuts like putting it into kegs rather than casks, Pasteurising rather than keeping it fresh, and using carbonation instead of pumping it naturally, in order to support their huuuuuuge ranges. If they focused on a smaller numbe…

There may be a bit of confusion here, on tap, in the us, usually, just means coming from a keg. Having 40 draft lines is not that odd and beer lasts a long time in a keg. If you meant 40+ cask served beers, then that would indeed require a lot of turnover

Re: Magic hat leaves behind a transformed craft beer industry in Vermont

#37

Post by chrisseaton »

StrangeDoctor wrote: post #36
chrisseaton wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fresh beer ideally lasts about five days. Are these places getting through a whole cask of all their forty beers every five days? Doesn't seem likely to me. I'm guessing that they're using shortcuts like putting it into kegs rather than casks, Pasteurising rather than keeping it fresh, and using carbonation instead of pumping it naturally, in order to support their huuuuuuge ranges. If they focused on a smaller numbe…

There may be a bit of confusion here, on tap, in the us, usually, just means coming from a keg. Having 40 draft lines is not that odd and beer lasts a long time in a keg. If you meant 40+ cask served beers, then that would indeed require a lot of turnover

Right, but that's what I mean. Instead of a couple of carefully produced natural cask beers, they have forty mass produced Pasteurised, carbonated kegs. Quantity over quality.

Re: Magic hat leaves behind a transformed craft beer industry in Vermont

#38

Post by waterfowl »

ilamont wrote: post #23

A lot of really good entrepreneurial food companies have come out of Vermont, Ben & Jerry's being the most famous. Like MH, it was acquired by a multinational company (Unilever) although it still strives to retain its independence and Vermont character. We live in an adjoining state, and get cheese, chocolate, beer, and syrup from Vermont producers. There's even roasted coffee beans from a producer up there that my w…

minor nitpick - B&J was purchased by Unilever which is similar but less reviled online than Nestle.

Re: Magic hat leaves behind a transformed craft beer industry in Vermont

#39

Post by dvtrn »

chrisseaton wrote: post #37
StrangeDoctor wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There may be a bit of confusion here, on tap, in the us, usually, just means coming from a keg. Having 40 draft lines is not that odd and beer lasts a long time in a keg. If you meant 40+ cask served beers, then that would indeed require a lot of turnover

Right, but that's what I mean. Instead of a couple of carefully produced natural cask beers, they have forty mass produced Pasteurised, carbonated kegs. Quantity over quality.

Question in search of some clarity: When you say “they” Are you referring to a specific beer made by a specific brewery when you refer to these pasteurized beverages?

At least as it pertains to the article, not all of Magic Hat’s products involve this brewing process, unless I’ve misunderstood you?

Re: Magic hat leaves behind a transformed craft beer industry in Vermont

#40

Post by ErikAugust »

beezle wrote: post #28
ErikAugust wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I still find Hill Farmstead nearly impossible to find, even being in Vermont. They make great beer, but also show that exclusivity adds a lot to the mystique.

AFAIK its only available on tap, frequently at ski area restaurants.

There are a couple places that may sell it outside of bars... Beverage Warehouse in Winooski comes to mind.
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