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Google Acquires North

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Re: Google Acquires North

#121
Not acquihire. Employees are not moving to alphabet.

North was a scam, and was about to be bought by patent trolls. This was a legal move by alphabet. They pretty much paid ransom to the North (Thalmic labs) founders to not be harassed by trolls later on.

I guess it at least shows that google haven't abandoned google-glass entirely (or their legal dept doesn't know they aren't in the glass business any more, i wouldn't doubt it)

Re: Google Acquires North

#122

Thalmic Labs/North helped to normalize the act of exaggerating the capabilities of your tech, lying to investors, raising millions of dollars and pivoting to something completely unrelated. We have to stop celebrating tech companies that are able to raise millions of dollars and still fail to deliver.

That's because they were in the business of selling shares, and now they sold them all. This story is as old as America itself. The bank that is now JP Morgan Chase, the sixth largest bank in the world, was started by Aaron Burr's fundraise for a ripoff water supply system in Manhattan. He collected $2mm, used $100,00 on the stated purpose and the rest to start a bank. These are our role models, where the point is to…

This story is as old as America itself

I think you means "This story is as old as Canada, itself." North was Canadian.

Also, the story is older than America. It goes way back to medieval Europe, at least. Possibly farther back than that in the Middle East, but that's not an area of history I know much about.

Re: Google Acquires North

#124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My experience with the startup scene in another country agrees with your description. When tech is funded by government incubators, it tends to become a fake imitation of the VC funded industry that we know from Silicon Valley. Which often is itself a fake imitation of actual innovation, so (fake imitation)^2.

> When tech is funded by government incubators, it tends to become a fake imitation of the VC funded industry that we know from Silicon Valley. Seems a little strong? https://www.iqt.org/portfolio/ (Cockroach Labs, GitLab, DataRobot, databricks, Cloudera, mongoDB (I know), probably more you've heard of) https://www.energy.gov/lpo/portfolio/portfolio-projects (Tesla) https://www.sbir.gov/news/success-stories (Qualcomm…

Sure there have been hits, but there have been a lot of failures too.

The problem with "government VC" is not the low hit rate--private VC has a low hit rate too.

The problem is also not that government funds get gamed--private VC gets gamed too. See WeWork for an absolutely enormous example.

The problem is really with the different cultural expectations for government vs private capital.

If a private VC firm loses 95% of their investments to failure and fraud, but has huge hits with the remaining 5%, well, that's just how VC works. The only thing that really matters is their net. If they end up with a big return, they are geniuses.

But if the government loses 95% of their investments, that's a ton of wasted taxpayer money. That's a lot of fodder for press, politicians, and activists to make hay out of. And if the remaining 5% are hits, well, the government does not exist to turn a profit. So the credit does not work out the same, even if the hit rate is similar.

Re: Google Acquires North

#125

Sigh, all I can think is yet another promising startup vanishes into the depths of Google, never to be seen again. Google, please stop buying companies, please learn to support your products and build a loyal customer base. You are not a startup anymore, you need to make the transformation that companies like Microsoft did, and quit moving fast and breaking things. People don't want an agile foundation, they want a h…

This trend will continue forever because, the way modern corporate capitalism is set up, publicly traded companies have a VASTLY lower cost of capital than private companies. Thus, private companies who are profitable at a much higher cost of capital can be bought almost risk free by public companies and run poorly and still be worth it because the public companies get money so cheaply.

Re: Google Acquires North

#126
post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure "promising startup" describes North (previously Thalmic Labs) that well. Everything I've heard around the Waterloo tech scene is that it was mostly smoke and mirrors from the founders who were able to maintain their own lifestyles using grants from the Canadian government. Tales from past employees are not flattering. Being bought by Google is likely the best thing that could happen to both the founders…

> mostly smoke and mirrors from the founders who were able to maintain their own lifestyles using grants from the Canadian government This describes a surprisingly high number of companies I’ve worked at in Canada. These SRED credits keep afloat so many companies that should have otherwise perished and that won’t ever go anywhere. You can even hire SRED consultants that will help you milk those credits as much as pos…

When I worked in a startup, just feeding the SRED consultant with info ended up eating hours and hours of time. The intent of the credit is for real foundational engineering research but the reality seems to be is that it ends up getting eaten by companies that are just applying existing tech in mostly non-novel ways, and consultants get to try to spin it otherwise.

It needs to be replaced.

Re: Google Acquires North

#127
post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Stackdriver did not disappear, but having used it daily for the past 4 years and witnessed its painfully slow and buggy migration into the GCP admin, I can't say it's a product that has visibly gotten much love. We kept using it for some things out of inertia, but I can't say it ever impressed me.

How so? I've only ever used it on GC, not pre-acquisition.

Most of the things that bothered me were fairly minor, but taken together they just didn't give me the impression that there was a lot of effort going into the product. Lots of janky UI (filtering/browsing logs being particularly cumbersome), and a bunch of things that seem promising at first but are very much "lite" versions of more powerful products like Pingdom/Sentry/DataDog. Also I always felt like the monitoring metrics were not as well integrated into the GCP system as they should have been, given that they're under the same roof...we spun up a Prometheus cluster to do it by hand instead.

Also, until recently the admin lived outside of the main GCP admin and logging into it required some kind of redirect-bouncing oauth handshake that was consistently buggy for me. Something to do with browser defaults/3rd party cookies along the chain of redirects that would cause an infinite loop. I managed to work around it on my work computer, but it was broken for at least a year...not awesome for a tool you'll be logging into in emergencies, often from other devices.

Re: Google Acquires North

#129
post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Google, please stop buying companies, please learn to support your products and build a loyal customer base. You are not a startup anymore, you need to make the transformation that companies like Microsoft did, and quit moving fast and breaking things. It's actually not Google's fault. It's the founders of these startups who can't resist their offer nor can they do anything to control the company once they have tak…

Are Snap and Dropbox really examples of what companies should do??

For resisting to selling your company because of another competitor wanting to buy you out? Yes, that is the example I'm talking about, not what they actually do which you seem to have insinuated. You would have asked the exact same question 24 years ago when Apple was months away from bankruptcy at the time even when it was in legal battle with Microsoft and Intel.

It's also not limited to those companies I mentioned, but 15 years ago, Microsoft, Google, Viacom, Myspace, Yahoo, AOL all wanted to buy Facebook pre-IPO and FB resisted all attempts and they have now become highly profitable themselves as such that they have owned the social media market. Even Netflix was approached an offer of $50 million by Blockbuster and resisted a buyout.

Given the hindsight of the growth of those companies, including Apple and Facebook, had you'd been the CEO of either of them, you'd think that selling wouldn't have been a good idea.

Re: Google Acquires North

#130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> mostly smoke and mirrors from the founders who were able to maintain their own lifestyles using grants from the Canadian government This describes a surprisingly high number of companies I’ve worked at in Canada. These SRED credits keep afloat so many companies that should have otherwise perished and that won’t ever go anywhere. You can even hire SRED consultants that will help you milk those credits as much as pos…

I’ve noticed the same thing. Have you found any good writing on this topic and how the American approach differs from the Canadian approach? I’ve been fascinated by this dynamic after spending most of my working life in the USA then returning to Canada, and just feeling like something is “off” whenever I talk to Canadian startups, and it feels like a lot of the time it comes down to the way the flow of investment dif…

imho it's not just the flow of investment. It's the smallness of the community. Many of the founders in the Toronto tech scene all know each other. From private school etc. At least when I was working for one 10 years ago, it all felt very incestuous and small.

Also in the US there's a real sense of having to hunt and compete for talent, but at least then in the Toronto startup scene you were to feel blessed for not having to work for a bank or insurance company, so put up the with the bullshit and dysfunction please...

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