Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

The End of the Redis Adventure

antirez.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

81–90 of 308 posts

Re: The End of the Redis Adventure

#81

Post by WJW »

wolco wrote: post #3

I would love a story on "I don’t like much what the underground programming world became in recent years" What could he mean? What underground programming world is he talking about?

Underground as in programming for fun or as art, because you enjoy it as a hobby/subculture. Opposed to the "above ground" programming world of programming for other people (possibly also for money, but OSS is often just for recognition) where people have demands about unimportant features, terminology, coding styles, codes of conduct, etc. Sometimes they get quite aggressive about their demands, too.

Re: The End of the Redis Adventure

#82

Post by dexen »

dilandau wrote: post #77
dexen wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This. The underground in underground programming refers to maintaining low visibility, as to present low target silhouette. Additional benefit is not attracting too many participants that are in it for the clout, rather than for solving problems & good engineering. Open Source is no longer sufficient for software freedom; the current 'battlefield' is maintaining security from activist pressure or gradual take-over.

This implies that a lot of the politicization of open source projects has to do with outsiders making power plays (for in group status or just because narcissism). I think this is part of it, for sure. I also think it can also manifest when parts of the community get trapped in a purity spiral, which is somewhat related but comes from within rather than without. Advice? I don't know. Stay underground and ignore the m…

Counting contributors & contributions is about as sensible as counting kLOC and pages of manual.

Conway's law about software architecture implies existence of management-space CAP theorem equivalent.

Communication suffers combinatorial explosion[1], and graph problems are pretty expensive to solve in meatspace.

Attention is an exhaustible resource, and easily DDoSed.

[edit]

dilandau - please note I've carefully avoided certain spicier keywords & expressions in the previous post as to not off put a casual reader and avoid attracting quick downvotes.

The couple spicy keywords in your response end up needlessly detracting a casual reader from the correct point you are making. And I'm not talking about the "fucking" adjective :)

--

[1] l = (n-1)*n/2

Re: The End of the Redis Adventure

#84

Post by pbowyer »

antirez wrote: post #63
cies wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was also intrigued by that sentence. I expect it means (open source) programming that happens outside of of big corps. But I'm unsure.

Yep it's the open source, and in general the "spontaneous" development world, that happens without big money, just for hacking. This "place" once was kinda free and not observed much. Now you can't say anything, if you don't respect a good practice (LOL) people yell at you on Twitter. Even saying that commenting is a good idea is a problem. Not cool.

> Even saying that commenting is a good idea is a problem.

I'm glad I'm not alone experiencing this.

One of the core open source projects I use has taken a no comments stance because "the code speaks for itself". It does if you're a core contributor, but if you dive in less frequently it takes a while to grok what's going on and re-build the mental model. Comments would reduce that.

Thanks for all you've done Salvatore, and for your blogging. Your enthusiasm puts the fun back into my programming!

Re: The End of the Redis Adventure

#85

Post by ptx »

pjmlp wrote: post #61
aboringusername wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's an interesting proposition. Whether it's Python, Redis, Laravel or Linux itself, a lot of software projects have been driven primarily by singular people and their decisions which shape the project over a period of time. One example that was mentioned in this thread was the whole "master" thing going on. Is Torvalds really going to get involved in that? Most likely no, and that's a decision he's free to make. I…

You already see this happening, on the IoT world there are plenty of competing FOSS OS clones, some of them POSIX based, common to all of them is the use of non-copyleft licenses.

How does copyleft relate to BDFL-style governance? Python, for example, had a BDFL until recently but isn't copyleft licensed.

Re: The End of the Redis Adventure

#86

Post by calpaterson »

eric_b wrote: post #50

So they're moving to a new "community based", "light governance" model. [1] There are plenty of problems with BDFL-style projects, but I think there are a lot of advantages too. Redis is unique in my experience in that it works the way you'd expect - it doesn't cause outages, it is fast, and it has a vanishingly small number of gotchas. The feature set is well curated and for the most part fits together cohesively. T…

> The most important thing Antirez did, in my opinion, was to say "No" to things. No to new features that didn't make sense.

Redis has had tremendous mission creep over the years. It started of course mostly as a volatile cache but I've now seen it also used as a message bus (in three different ways: BLPOP, PUB/SUB and Streams), for service discovery and as a general purpose database - something that Redis Labs (in my opinion: wrongly) encourages.

Memcache existed in 2009 when Redis was first released, also as a volatile cache...and still is just a volatile cache. Memcache is what "saying no" looks like. Redis is what "saying yes" looks like - and there are a lot of gotchas.

Re: The End of the Redis Adventure

#87

Post by brobdingnagians »

aboringusername wrote: post #54
eric_b wrote: post #50

So they're moving to a new "community based", "light governance" model. [1] There are plenty of problems with BDFL-style projects, but I think there are a lot of advantages too. Redis is unique in my experience in that it works the way you'd expect - it doesn't cause outages, it is fast, and it has a vanishingly small number of gotchas. The feature set is well curated and for the most part fits together cohesively. T…

It's an interesting proposition. Whether it's Python, Redis, Laravel or Linux itself, a lot of software projects have been driven primarily by singular people and their decisions which shape the project over a period of time. One example that was mentioned in this thread was the whole "master" thing going on. Is Torvalds really going to get involved in that? Most likely no, and that's a decision he's free to make. I…

>> "old white guy in charge of Linux"

Erhmmm, why does his age or colour matter in this context? Debate can happen about people and their leadership style, (I'm not a fan of Torvalds) but when the first criteria someone sees for criticizing another person is their age, colour, or race, that seems a bit shallow and biased.

Re: The End of the Redis Adventure

#88

Post by nuclearnice1 »

r_police wrote: post #71
conjectures wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What is "underground programming world"? If you have to ask... ;)

Sorry to be that guy but, why are you posting comments that lead to topic derailing that add nothing to the discussion?

Agree. I’d like to thank conjectures, brodouevencode, Bjartr, kungtotte, m0xte, fidelramos, chii and pokot0 for their contributions, but gently suggest none of the jokes were really that funny. Said well: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7609289

Re: The End of the Redis Adventure

#89

Post by [deleted] »

brobdingnagians wrote: post #87
aboringusername wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's an interesting proposition. Whether it's Python, Redis, Laravel or Linux itself, a lot of software projects have been driven primarily by singular people and their decisions which shape the project over a period of time. One example that was mentioned in this thread was the whole "master" thing going on. Is Torvalds really going to get involved in that? Most likely no, and that's a decision he's free to make. I…

>> "old white guy in charge of Linux" Erhmmm, why does his age or colour matter in this context? Debate can happen about people and their leadership style, (I'm not a fan of Torvalds) but when the first criteria someone sees for criticizing another person is their age, colour, or race, that seems a bit shallow and biased.

[deleted]

Re: The End of the Redis Adventure

#90

Post by asguy »

aboringusername wrote: post #54
eric_b wrote: post #50

So they're moving to a new "community based", "light governance" model. [1] There are plenty of problems with BDFL-style projects, but I think there are a lot of advantages too. Redis is unique in my experience in that it works the way you'd expect - it doesn't cause outages, it is fast, and it has a vanishingly small number of gotchas. The feature set is well curated and for the most part fits together cohesively. T…

It's an interesting proposition. Whether it's Python, Redis, Laravel or Linux itself, a lot of software projects have been driven primarily by singular people and their decisions which shape the project over a period of time. One example that was mentioned in this thread was the whole "master" thing going on. Is Torvalds really going to get involved in that? Most likely no, and that's a decision he's free to make. I…

> I'm sure many would love to see some change there and finally overrule Torvalds' decisions.

Is forking no longer a solution to this problem? Or are you just wanting to wrestle control away from Linus?

Post reply on HN