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NASA names headquarters after first Black female engineer Mary W. Jackson

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Re: NASA names headquarters after first Black female engineer Mary W. Jackson

#23

I've seen negative comments of people claiming this is fruitless and that it pretends to solve racism forever (here and elsewhere). No one involved in naming this thought that was the case. They are giving overdue recognition. I can't imagine why people would be negative about this besides feeling threatened.

There is nothing meritorious about being black, or being a female, or being white, or being male. You cannot choose your race, or your biological sex. You didn't earn these traits, and you aren't a better or worse human being for having any of them.

The NASA HQ was named after somebody to celebrate traits they didn't earn or choose. There are plenty of engineers that were objectively better engineers (I'm sure there were or are many black female engineers who are better engineers than this individual). And there were many engineers that contributed more to the space program than this individual.

If their achievements were that incredible, we would've heard much more about them. Plenty of white engineers had successful careers, contributed to their program, performed well, but will forever go un-named, and unappreciated. And that's fine. Nobody is complaining about that, and neither am I. That's life. But to pluck somebody out of a huge number of engineers because of something they had no control over (the color of their skin) and then name a building after them because of it? Absurd.

Re: NASA names headquarters after first Black female engineer Mary W. Jackson

#24

This woman should be on the front of a limited edition $100 US bill.

I agree and I’m not sure who’s downvoting you except people afraid of change.

It’s a gesture that doesn’t literally cost anything but can make blacks feel appreciated and some sort of justice, a symbolic one. And yet, some people’s ego won’t allow for that. They have nothing to loose and yet their ego is freaking out.

Re: NASA names headquarters after first Black female engineer Mary W. Jackson

#25

I've seen negative comments of people claiming this is fruitless and that it pretends to solve racism forever (here and elsewhere). No one involved in naming this thought that was the case. They are giving overdue recognition. I can't imagine why people would be negative about this besides feeling threatened.

There is nothing meritorious about being black, or being a female, or being white, or being male. You cannot choose your race, or your biological sex. You didn't earn these traits, and you aren't a better or worse human being for having any of them. The NASA HQ was named after somebody to celebrate traits they didn't earn or choose. There are plenty of engineers that were objectively better engineers (I'm sure there…

Overcoming sexism and racism is something to be proud of and for others to celebrate. Nobody's celebrating this person for their identity in isolation but overcoming a situation where all the odds are very much stacked against a person of such an identity.

> If their achievements were that incredible, we would've heard much more about them. Plenty of white engineers had successful careers, contributed to their program, performed well, but will forever go un-named

This isn't remotely true. The majority of things are named after white men to the exclusion of everyone else.

Re: NASA names headquarters after first Black female engineer Mary W. Jackson

#26

I've seen negative comments of people claiming this is fruitless and that it pretends to solve racism forever (here and elsewhere). No one involved in naming this thought that was the case. They are giving overdue recognition. I can't imagine why people would be negative about this besides feeling threatened.

There is nothing meritorious about being black, or being a female, or being white, or being male. You cannot choose your race, or your biological sex. You didn't earn these traits, and you aren't a better or worse human being for having any of them. The NASA HQ was named after somebody to celebrate traits they didn't earn or choose. There are plenty of engineers that were objectively better engineers (I'm sure there…

It’s a symbolic gesture relax. While it irks you it might inspire a young black kid to become an astronomer or phisicist or astronaut. As a white there are plenty of inspiring people. Some of them have been power hungry and ruthless and nobody knows how many people they trampled on. Some of those are white symbols. Why not let balcks have their own?

Re: NASA names headquarters after first Black female engineer Mary W. Jackson

#27

I've seen negative comments of people claiming this is fruitless and that it pretends to solve racism forever (here and elsewhere). No one involved in naming this thought that was the case. They are giving overdue recognition. I can't imagine why people would be negative about this besides feeling threatened.

I dont know if feeling threatened but aware this person’s contribution was not the reason for the naming but the fact that black people were supressed. It’s a generous move but not highly meritocratic. People might have a problem or two with that. I want to remind them we dont live in a meritocratic society anyway and the powerful snatch the merit away like a giant magnet. It will naturally bruise some egos and pump…

> I want to remind them we dont live in a meritocratic society

The reason I love the sciences is that in general, people are more meritocratic in those circles compared to others. I've found especially in scientific academia that people are far more meritocratic compared to other disciplines. This also applies at science/engineering companies. No, not at all levels (the more business-y you get, the less of a meritocracy it becomes). But usually team-leads, senior engineers, etc. rise because of merit. Always exceptions, but in general. Much more than as an accounting firm where you rise because you know somebody who knows somebody.

Unfortunately, as time goes on, I've seen academic circles in sci&eng, and especially tech companies (and silicone valley in general) become much more interested in stay relevant, keeping up with social trends and movements, and appearing progressive. You see this with all the FAANG companies calmoring to be the first to speak out against some injustice or another, or be the first to take a stand on Their Platform(TM).

And with this, the meritocracy has slowly declined. You don't rise in a company because you're a skilled engineer - you can rise because you're a token minority. Or because you're the most outspoken on a social injustice and can see a way for your company to solve it (sorry, profit from it). You can be rewarded because you were the first (insert random minority here) to solve a problem or do something that plenty of other people had already done. Rather than celebrating scientific advancement, we're now celebrating the type of people making that advancement. What next, the first black woman to clone a GitHub repo? Let's name the GitHub HQ after that.

Re: NASA names headquarters after first Black female engineer Mary W. Jackson

#28
post #10
post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not much of a movie watcher but this one is an outstanding one! Highly recommend it to anyone who hasn't already seen it.

A great movie indeed however it uses the white savior trope gratuitously. The scene where Kevin Costner’s character lets Octavia Spencer’s character into the mission control room never happened in real life.

There are other... issues with the movie. At the end, Katherine Johnson is shown running between her office in Virginia, and Mercury mission control, which was actually in Florida. This has to do with her checking computer calculations of orbits for John Glenn's flight -- something she actually did do, but it's depicted as being done in minutes, and it actually took her more like a week. (Computers of the time were damn slow by modern standards, but they were still faster than that!) It was not a big secret that the Redstone rocket (a souped-up V2) couldn't put something as heavy as a Mercury capsule into orbit. And so forth.

The movie's a good story, but if you want actual history, read the book.

Re: NASA names headquarters after first Black female engineer Mary W. Jackson

#29

I've seen negative comments of people claiming this is fruitless and that it pretends to solve racism forever (here and elsewhere). No one involved in naming this thought that was the case. They are giving overdue recognition. I can't imagine why people would be negative about this besides feeling threatened.

I think what those people mean when they say that is that it hasn't materially changed anything for most people, unlike what some reforms (or revolution) could do for people. They see it as a form of tokenism which they think historically hasn't helped much.

Personally, I see both sides. I think this is actual progress that will indirectly have positive material benefits while also recognizing we can obviously do better than this.

Re: NASA names headquarters after first Black female engineer Mary W. Jackson

#30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I dont know if feeling threatened but aware this person’s contribution was not the reason for the naming but the fact that black people were supressed. It’s a generous move but not highly meritocratic. People might have a problem or two with that. I want to remind them we dont live in a meritocratic society anyway and the powerful snatch the merit away like a giant magnet. It will naturally bruise some egos and pump…

> I want to remind them we dont live in a meritocratic society The reason I love the sciences is that in general, people are more meritocratic in those circles compared to others. I've found especially in scientific academia that people are far more meritocratic compared to other disciplines. This also applies at science/engineering companies. No, not at all levels (the more business-y you get, the less of a meritocr…

People who come to surface are either genial or narcisistic prize seekers. A lot of white people worth mentioning were forgotten because others trampled on them. Don’t be so sure it’s so meritocratic, thats just a myth
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