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Onivim 2: Lightweight, Modal Code Editor

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Re: Onivim 2: Lightweight, Modal Code Editor

#11

Post by ravenide »

rudolph9 wrote: post #4

I feel like a curmudgeon when say this but tools that make me leave my terminal ultimately never sit well. It always feels so limiting when you hit the point where you’re digging through the guts of some framework that basically a web app packaged as a desktop app. I see why people use it and maybe it not even a web app but I’m old enough to know vim gets me everything I need and using some ide desktop app is going t…

I love vim and have never met someone who used it more fluently than me. Yet I find it lacking. I can never get IDE features like code navigation and completion to really work. I use YouCompleteMe like everyone else but it’s just not as good as Jetbrains. It randomly stops working. Parameter hints don’t really work. This is for C++, by the way. The JavaScript situation is even worse.

My dream is also for vim to be the integrated, full-featured software package you describe, but at the moment I find it falls short.

Re: Onivim 2: Lightweight, Modal Code Editor

#12

Post by richeyryan »

teruakohatu wrote: post #9

Does anyone know why Oni ditched neovim, which they used in the original Oni editor, and instead turned vim into a library (libvim) for Onivim2?

https://github.com/onivim/libvim#why-is-libvim-based-on-vim-...

Guts of it is that Neovim didn't play nicely with their OCaml build and Vim did. Rather than invest time in working through the problem, they went ahead with Vim but remain open to supporting Neovim.

Re: Onivim 2: Lightweight, Modal Code Editor

#13

Post by lapinot »

bauerd wrote: post #6
rudolph9 wrote: post #4

I feel like a curmudgeon when say this but tools that make me leave my terminal ultimately never sit well. It always feels so limiting when you hit the point where you’re digging through the guts of some framework that basically a web app packaged as a desktop app. I see why people use it and maybe it not even a web app but I’m old enough to know vim gets me everything I need and using some ide desktop app is going t…

Fully agree. Primary reason I use emacs is because I can run it in my terminal (and I never got the hang of modal editing). All my readline shortcuts just work everywhere there, and copypasting from the tmux scrollback buffer is a breeze

Ever tried https://github.com/jyp/boon? Modal editing for emacs, describing itself as ergonomic and respecting emacs conventions. Disclaimer: not using myself, i'm a happy http://kakoune.org/ user.

Re: Onivim 2: Lightweight, Modal Code Editor

#14

Post by Cthulhu_ »

O_H_E wrote: post #10
mkl wrote: post #7

The licensing is a bit complicated. It is not really open source, until later, when it is: "∙ Free for non-commercial and educational use." "∙ Commercial use requires the purchase of a license." and then "Because of the support we've received from open source communities, we've decided to dual-license the code after 18 months - every commit, starting with 017c513, will be dual-licensed via the MIT License 18 months f…

It is really intriguing to see how this works for them. Making money from normal open source projects is really hard. I am really hoping to see some innovation in this sector (FOSS+Economical sustainability) sooner rather than later.

The other post about Github sponsorship works; it means the code remains open source and the application free to use, whilst the developers get paid for contributing to it.

That said, I think it's mainly down to companies that use the open source software to start paying for it. All companies that use open source software - and be fair, this is pretty much all software companies - should reserve some budget to sponsor and donate to open source project and developers.

Second, there's a lot of open source projects whose developers are paid for by a company, e.g. Linux, Chromium, etc. That code is still open source and free, AND the developers get paid.

Re: Onivim 2: Lightweight, Modal Code Editor

#15

Post by typon »

ravenide wrote: post #11
rudolph9 wrote: post #4

I feel like a curmudgeon when say this but tools that make me leave my terminal ultimately never sit well. It always feels so limiting when you hit the point where you’re digging through the guts of some framework that basically a web app packaged as a desktop app. I see why people use it and maybe it not even a web app but I’m old enough to know vim gets me everything I need and using some ide desktop app is going t…

I love vim and have never met someone who used it more fluently than me. Yet I find it lacking. I can never get IDE features like code navigation and completion to really work. I use YouCompleteMe like everyone else but it’s just not as good as Jetbrains. It randomly stops working. Parameter hints don’t really work. This is for C++, by the way. The JavaScript situation is even worse. My dream is also for vim to be th…

I find CoC to be much better than YouCompleteMe for both C++ and Python. Regardless, it's still not as good as Jetbrains. I don't know if it's a fundamental limitation of the underlying language Server (ccls) or CoC has issues with itself, but i experience random breakages in the autocompletion all the time too.

Re: Onivim 2: Lightweight, Modal Code Editor

#16

Post by mkl »

O_H_E wrote: post #10
mkl wrote: post #7

The licensing is a bit complicated. It is not really open source, until later, when it is: "∙ Free for non-commercial and educational use." "∙ Commercial use requires the purchase of a license." and then "Because of the support we've received from open source communities, we've decided to dual-license the code after 18 months - every commit, starting with 017c513, will be dual-licensed via the MIT License 18 months f…

It is really intriguing to see how this works for them. Making money from normal open source projects is really hard. I am really hoping to see some innovation in this sector (FOSS+Economical sustainability) sooner rather than later.

I think once a program is established and has all its main features in there and polished, the 18 month old version may not be very different than the current version for practical purposes. I.e. if this model works, it may only work well while they're getting started and adding new useful primary features.

Re: Onivim 2: Lightweight, Modal Code Editor

#17

Post by cercatrova »

rudolph9 wrote: post #4

I feel like a curmudgeon when say this but tools that make me leave my terminal ultimately never sit well. It always feels so limiting when you hit the point where you’re digging through the guts of some framework that basically a web app packaged as a desktop app. I see why people use it and maybe it not even a web app but I’m old enough to know vim gets me everything I need and using some ide desktop app is going t…

I want to use Vim, but I don't want to set up all the plugins and figure all that out. I want it to "just work" like VSCode does. VSCode's Vim emulation isn't that great, though.

Onivim 2 for the record is not a web app, it's a completely native app built in ReasonML (OCaml) and they even had to build their own GUI framework (Revery) to make this editor. It's extremely fast.

Re: Onivim 2: Lightweight, Modal Code Editor

#18

Post by nchase »

rudolph9 wrote: post #4

I feel like a curmudgeon when say this but tools that make me leave my terminal ultimately never sit well. It always feels so limiting when you hit the point where you’re digging through the guts of some framework that basically a web app packaged as a desktop app. I see why people use it and maybe it not even a web app but I’m old enough to know vim gets me everything I need and using some ide desktop app is going t…

This is how I feel as well. But I know a lot of folks use the terminal inside of e.g. VS Code for this.

I wonder what they'd say in response?

For me, a lot of the value is in having a single app that I can turn to for most of my dev tasks. That app happens to be a terminal (with different projects contained in different tmux sessions).

Re: Onivim 2: Lightweight, Modal Code Editor

#19

Post by mumblemumble »

nchase wrote: post #18
rudolph9 wrote: post #4

I feel like a curmudgeon when say this but tools that make me leave my terminal ultimately never sit well. It always feels so limiting when you hit the point where you’re digging through the guts of some framework that basically a web app packaged as a desktop app. I see why people use it and maybe it not even a web app but I’m old enough to know vim gets me everything I need and using some ide desktop app is going t…

This is how I feel as well. But I know a lot of folks use the terminal inside of e.g. VS Code for this. I wonder what they'd say in response? For me, a lot of the value is in having a single app that I can turn to for most of my dev tasks. That app happens to be a terminal (with different projects contained in different tmux sessions).

For my part, I use IntelliJ for Java, vscode for everything else, and iterm2 for more intensive terminal work, all running in fullscreen mode and/or tiled using Rectangle. On OS X.

It gives something very close to the "hands never leave the keyboard" experience that I like about living in the terminal, while also letting me fall back to a mouse when that would be quicker or easier. It also gets me the nice things that I expect are only possible to do well in a graphical environment, such as minimaps and displaying graphical information like plots or dependency graphs.

I do find that my text-mode editor skills are weakening over time, and that does have an impact on my productivity when I have to do a decent whack of work on a remote server. But that's not something that I personally have to do often enough to be a major concern.

Re: Onivim 2: Lightweight, Modal Code Editor

#20

Post by qq11ww22ee33 »

rudolph9 wrote: post #4

I feel like a curmudgeon when say this but tools that make me leave my terminal ultimately never sit well. It always feels so limiting when you hit the point where you’re digging through the guts of some framework that basically a web app packaged as a desktop app. I see why people use it and maybe it not even a web app but I’m old enough to know vim gets me everything I need and using some ide desktop app is going t…

Any sufficiently complicated CLI text editor setup contains an ad hoc, informally-specified, bug-ridden, slow implementation of half of IntelliJ IDEA.
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