I Am Deleting the Blog • Hacker News Board

Re: I Am Deleting the Blog

#491

Post by dlkf » Tue, Jun 23, 2020, 12:43 PM UTC

artsyca wrote: post #418

gringoDan wrote: post #394

Reading this made me think of two essays I've recently revisited. 1. The Sound of Silence, by Jessica Livingston Three years ago she argued that the smartest people are silencing themselves because the downside risk of being attacked for (misinterpretations of) their opinions are too high. People are wary of sharing useful information outside of trusted circles, which serves to consolidate power with insiders – those…

I'd say this forum is exactly this. How often have I self censored because I just don't want the downvotes?

This feels like an instance of negativity-bias. If you're willing to self-censor to avoid downvotes shouldn't you also be willing to shill / virtue signal for upvotes?

My problem with downvotes isn't the effect on my score. It's the fact that the font becomes paler. Dissenting opinions are singled out in a way that makes them look bad/wrong. I also don't like how the UX doesn't represent the distribution. A post with no votes will look like a post with 50 upvotes and 50 downvotes.

I am fine with downvotes, and with some UX mechanism to let people know that a post is being downvoted. But I think the current UX engenders groupthink.

Re: I Am Deleting the Blog

#492

Post by fche » Tue, Jun 23, 2020, 12:44 PM UTC

underwater wrote: post #488

gringoDan wrote: post #394

Reading this made me think of two essays I've recently revisited. 1. The Sound of Silence, by Jessica Livingston Three years ago she argued that the smartest people are silencing themselves because the downside risk of being attacked for (misinterpretations of) their opinions are too high. People are wary of sharing useful information outside of trusted circles, which serves to consolidate power with insiders – those…

Paul's post has always felt like a wordy defense of the "well, actually". Lots of us passionate techies like to weigh in on every topic and forget that not everything is academic. Sometimes the world doesn't need to hear our opinion. That doesn't mean we're being censored.

I didn't need to hear your opinion.

Re: I Am Deleting the Blog

#493

Post by jahaja » Tue, Jun 23, 2020, 12:45 PM UTC

flyingfences wrote: post #481

jahaja wrote: post #411

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you guys really feel that you're on the right side of history by harassing an investigative journalist?

In short: yes. To expand: nobody here is harassing the journalist. The journalist harassed the blogger. The commenters are providing polite, critical feedback.

How can you possibly know this?

Re: I Am Deleting the Blog

#494

Post by [deleted] » Tue, Jun 23, 2020, 12:46 PM UTC

npstr wrote: post #111

Similar effect when reading the news on a topic that one is an expert in - they usually get it incredibly wrong. And then you turn the page and read the next article completely forgetting how bad the reporting actually is - there is no reason to assume they do a better job on topics that one is not an expert in! I think this bias had a name but I can't remember it.

[deleted]

Re: I Am Deleting the Blog

#495

Post by entropyneur » Tue, Jun 23, 2020, 12:47 PM UTC

gringoDan wrote: post #394

Reading this made me think of two essays I've recently revisited. 1. The Sound of Silence, by Jessica Livingston Three years ago she argued that the smartest people are silencing themselves because the downside risk of being attacked for (misinterpretations of) their opinions are too high. People are wary of sharing useful information outside of trusted circles, which serves to consolidate power with insiders – those…

I love "What You Can't Say" and have incorporated the conformist test into my moral compass. But I think the shift to use of shame for society regulation is a positive development. I'd much rather be downvoted on HN or called names on Twitter than beaten up or deprived of freedom. But maybe that's just me.

Re: I Am Deleting the Blog

#496

Post by jka » Tue, Jun 23, 2020, 12:48 PM UTC

cmeacham98 wrote: post #424

jka wrote: post #416

There's quite a lot of scope for interpretation of this statement: > Unfortunately, he told me he had discovered my real name and would reveal it in the article, ie doxx me. It's not clear from the post whether there was any conversation with the journalist about this aspect of the planned article, and/or whether there were any requests not to include the person's full name. I think most of us agree that staying well…

From the blog post: > When I expressed these fears to the reporter, he said that it was New York Times policy to include real names, and he couldn’t change that. What more details are needed?

The intent and nature of the article could be important; and where it exists on various spectrums including newsworthiness, public importance, accuracy, information content.

It's also possible that the article - even if hardly read today - could become relevant in future in ways that we can't currently understand.

It could be argued that deleting the blog was an attempt to influence or close down aspects of the yet-unpublished article and reporting process. In other ways it may have actually added additional context.

Re: I Am Deleting the Blog

#497

Post by matwood » Tue, Jun 23, 2020, 12:48 PM UTC

_wldu wrote: post #431

gringoDan wrote: post #394

Reading this made me think of two essays I've recently revisited. 1. The Sound of Silence, by Jessica Livingston Three years ago she argued that the smartest people are silencing themselves because the downside risk of being attacked for (misinterpretations of) their opinions are too high. People are wary of sharing useful information outside of trusted circles, which serves to consolidate power with insiders – those…

Great post. I wish more people would genuinely listen to those they disagree with. When we shut people down or make them feel uncomfortable/threatened to the point that they won't speak, what have we gained?

> I wish more people would genuinely listen to those they disagree with.

I had a bit of this discussion on HN not long ago. I love to debate and hear ideas from those I disagree with. But, that's not what people are often doing today. They are using your statement to appeal to others to listen and accept their clearly racist ideas or provable wrong, anti-science ideas.

IMO, it's intellectually dishonest and a debate I have a hard time continuing.

Re: I Am Deleting the Blog

#498

Post by SuoDuanDao » Tue, Jun 23, 2020, 12:48 PM UTC

Angostura wrote: post #278

I was a journalist for 20 years working in the B2B IT magazine sector in the UK. We took what we did seriously, strove for accuracy and took pride in informative reporting. There are lots of journalists like this, so I am sad to see how many people are dismissive of the work. I can understand the anger at the NYT journalist's stance here, but I suppose I would say that we only have the blog author's view at the momen…

I support good journalism when I can, but I wish the profession as a whole would stop taking so much damnable pride. It's clearly edged over into widespread hubris.

I mean no insult to you personally, but I think the worse a journalist is the less money there is to pay them with. Pride is still free though. I'd like to see journalists practice some professional humility.

Re: I Am Deleting the Blog

#499

Post by raxxorrax » Tue, Jun 23, 2020, 12:50 PM UTC

chillacy wrote: post #14

This is a tragedy, Scott Alexander is such a thoughtful writer. I wish journalists would come up with some professional standards and make the title licensed, like doctor or lawyer. Right now we all recognize how important journalism is but journalists themselves run the gamut from ethical investigative journalists to clickbait manufacturers. Imagine if journalists also had to adhere to the equivalent of attorney cli…

People just don't buy newspapers anymore since the net is full of news articles. Your business model is basically attracting as many people as possible to your site. Advertisers were always the largest customers but today the reader is completely exempt from business relations.

Re: I Am Deleting the Blog

#500

Post by 737min » Tue, Jun 23, 2020, 12:51 PM UTC

It’s clear that the NYTimes is in the wrong here & doxxing an anonymous blogger, possibly b/c some of his views don’t align with theirs.

Everyone: please take a minute & send a very polite email to the NYT so we can get SlaterCodex back.