Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Executive order expected to suspend H-1B, other visas until end of year

npr.org

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

641–650 of 684 posts

Re: Executive order expected to suspend H-1B, other visas until end of year

#641

Post by pascalxus »

hintymad wrote: post #597
pascalxus wrote: post #589

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why are people so quick to always blame teachers? What makes you think throwing even more money at the problem will make things better? Growing up in a poor area, I went to some of the "worst" schools you can imagine (one even had to get shut down) and I had one of the most inspiring history teachers there, that I still remember to this day. And all the other teachers were great too. It's not the fault of the teacher…

No, I'm not blaming teachers for all the disciplinary problems in school. I am blaming bad teachers for squandering time of ordinary kids -- kids like me who have a shot if pushed and educated properly. You're lucky to have great teachers, and I just think we need more of such kind. As for bad schools, let me give you a few examples and you can check out the documentary Waiting For "Superman" to get a more grim pictu…

You can't blame teachers if the students don't do well on standardized tests. If you want to know why students don't do well on these tests, just spend a week or two substituting for teachers (or go there as a student) in one of those inner city schools. I guarantee, you'll have an epiphany and you'll see why they don't score well. It doesn't have anything to do with teaching, the problem is cultural.

Re: Executive order expected to suspend H-1B, other visas until end of year

#642

Post by learc83 »

peripitea wrote: post #471
artificial wrote: post #384

Earlier quoted context omitted.

O type Visas have no quota [0]. This is what the H1B are represented as though in practice suppress wages[1][2]. This issue is decades in the making and companies exploiting these programs earned their scrutiny. Especially when there's massive unemployment companies importing labor under these auspices need to be called out. [0] https://www.uscis.gov/working-united-states/temporary-worker... [1] https://www.wsj.com/a…

O visas are much harder to get than H-1B. I've hired a bunch of people via H-1B that we could not have hired via O. None of them were displacing American workers -- we would have hired just as many (or more) qualified American workers if they had been available too. So it seems disingenuous to imply that O covers the intended purpose of H-1B. (For the record, I agree that companies like Tata abuse H-1B and that sort…

>None of them were displacing American workers -- we would have hired just as many (or more) qualified American workers if they had been available too.

Did you try increasing salaries until you could find applicants. I'm virtually certain that you did not.

What you mean is that you couldn't find American workers at the price you were willing to pay, and because you weren't willing to pay the market price, you found another market.

If you could hire 20 people on H-1Bs but you only have enough money to hire 10 local people. You have displaced 10 American workers.

Re: Executive order expected to suspend H-1B, other visas until end of year

#643

Post by tekknik »

MisterBastahrd wrote: post #637
tekknik wrote: post #623

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which crimes are situational? And I still don’t agree that someone committing a crime is the victim here. To entertain that idea is just silly. For profit prisons are more cost effective than government run prisons. We are a capitalist society, people seek profit here, including the entirety of the country.

Nah, what's silly is the idea that we need to rationalize uses of force against citizens by private third parties. It's fundamentally stupid and should be illegal because it incentivizes incarceration. And most people don't "seek profit" here in their day to day lives. That's zero-sum idiocy.

I guess we’ll just agree to disagree on the first part.

And the second part, I’m guessing most people don’t work then?

Re: Executive order expected to suspend H-1B, other visas until end of year

#644

Post by tekknik »

jhardy54 wrote: post #634
tekknik wrote: post #624

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So because someone has a counter opinion from yours to refuse debate but stand on a public forum without desire to be challenged? Wow.

I'm happy to have discussions with people I disagree with, but generally once you're down the "poverty is good, actually" [0] rabbit hole I think a discussion would be a waste of both of our time. I think you should be embarrassed at edgelord takes like "I don’t see the value an impoverished set of humans can provide" [1], and I don't have any interest in talking with far-right extremists. Bye. [0]: https://news.ycom…

Read the rest of the comment, which is the point you’re failing to realize. You’re judging without understanding the complete picture. So again read that comment again and read it from a logical standpoint instead of emotional. It literally says the next sentence they have value in some situation and your failure to understand that some poor bread maker can’t have anything valid to say when writing software or building a rocket. That’s my opinion, change it if you want with facts. Not everybody that disagrees with you is a right wing extremist. Some of us are capable of discussing actual facts and values. And you also pointed to a comment made after your comment so how this can be influential in your first comment suggests you have some ability to travel through time.

Re: Executive order expected to suspend H-1B, other visas until end of year

#645

Post by femiagbabiaka »

we need to get rid of the executive order or at least severely limit its scope. both Obama and Trump have abused it -- presidents should not be able to hand down sweeping regulatory change like this at the drop of a hat without going through the legislature.

Re: Executive order expected to suspend H-1B, other visas until end of year

#646

Post by tekknik »

tekknik wrote: post #644
jhardy54 wrote: post #634

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm happy to have discussions with people I disagree with, but generally once you're down the "poverty is good, actually" [0] rabbit hole I think a discussion would be a waste of both of our time. I think you should be embarrassed at edgelord takes like "I don’t see the value an impoverished set of humans can provide" [1], and I don't have any interest in talking with far-right extremists. Bye. [0]: https://news.ycom…

Read the rest of the comment, which is the point you’re failing to realize. You’re judging without understanding the complete picture. So again read that comment again and read it from a logical standpoint instead of emotional. It literally says the next sentence they have value in some situation and your failure to understand that some poor bread maker can’t have anything valid to say when writing software or buildi…

To further explain my position, I actually don't disagree that help should be given if possible. But right now I don't see why given we have uneducated and poor people still within the US we should help another country. IFF we have this problem resolved, AND we have surplus resources (money, goods, etc), then clearly why not provide as much help as possible? But when we have yet to solve the problem here it's an ask to divert resources. So then the value proposition question comes up. If I must divert resources then this must somehow create more value for me to justify it, so that I can then in turn help those in need in my country that these resources could be going to help instead.

Re: Executive order expected to suspend H-1B, other visas until end of year

#647

Post by president »

codelord wrote: post #313

Disclaimer: I'm an immigrant. There are companies like Cognizant/InfoSys/Tata/... whose business model is based on abusing the H1B system, and that's obviously wrong and I'm quite surprised they get away with it. I'm not defending that. To those who broadly argue against skilled visas, consider this: Most H1B immigrants are between 20-30 age range. The prime age to join the workforce. Think how much investment you ha…

> People seem to think that number of jobs is a limited constant and if you stop immigrants that will have a positive effect on the economy. But in reality companies can simply just scale.

This is completely wrong. Jobs are zero-sum. One H1-B worker hired is one lost American job opportunity. It's not that hard to understand and taxes have nothing to do with this. Yes, companies can scale jobs but how often are they doing this and how does it help if they are also scaling up the number of H1-B workers?

Re: Executive order expected to suspend H-1B, other visas until end of year

#648

Post by kevin_thibedeau »

jpmoral wrote: post #528
pascalxus wrote: post #467

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A google job is like the top 1-3%. The vast majority of people don't make anywhere near that much. second, it's not about hatred for immigrants. It's just about jobs and housing. And, there's simply not enough of those to go around. I mean, sure we could have more immigrants. But, make no mistake, it will reduce the amount high end jobs available and reduce the housing supply even more. And, actually, most blue state…

This doesn't address GPs question about why, if local talent is plentiful, companies are willing to spend a lot of money and jump through several hoops to pay top dollar to immigrants when they could pay the same to a local and not have to spend extra money and effort.

The locals are not captive workers and will do anti-business things like starting a family.

Re: Executive order expected to suspend H-1B, other visas until end of year

#649

Post by president »

Forgeties79 wrote: post #4

This has gotten very old very fast (beyond the obvious cruelty). I have several friends who keep watching their colleagues just have to up and leave over this and it’s causing a ton of issues for businesses that employ folks on work visas in general. It’s just disruptive to be disruptive/feed the base.

But you don't consider that maybe it's still a net positive that they were able to come to the US to get decent working experience for a number of years? At the same time, an unemployed American worker may now have a chance for the same job. How is this a bad thing?

Re: Executive order expected to suspend H-1B, other visas until end of year

#650

Post by bJGVygG7MQVF8c »

codelord wrote: post #313

Disclaimer: I'm an immigrant. There are companies like Cognizant/InfoSys/Tata/... whose business model is based on abusing the H1B system, and that's obviously wrong and I'm quite surprised they get away with it. I'm not defending that. To those who broadly argue against skilled visas, consider this: Most H1B immigrants are between 20-30 age range. The prime age to join the workforce. Think how much investment you ha…

> Think how much investment you have to make on a child's health care and education to make them into a highly skilled workforce.

Let me fix that for you:

Think how much investment you miss out on — investment in a child's education to make them into a citizen who will carry your country's patrimony into the following generation.

Post reply on HN