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After GitHub CEO backs Black Lives Matter, workers demand an end to ICE contract

latimes.com

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Re: After GitHub CEO backs Black Lives Matter, workers demand an end to ICE contract

#831

Post by pas »

jacksnipe wrote: post #600
dnissley wrote: post #518

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Really all you need to do is google "twitter mob". The most common cases involve people who did something bad, but where the punishment meted out was totally disproportional to the crime itself. Justine Sacco is the classic case, who made a bad joke and had her life turned upside down. Then you have the cases where people are so full of emotion that they get basic facts wrong. James Damore is a good example of this,…

Uh, I read the James Damore memo, and that's what I got out of it. It's the classic groundwork for an argument of scientific sexism.

The memo called into question the diversity effort's efficiency and methods, because it pointed out that it seems that the effort had no rational grounding, therefore it was succeeding at best as an expensive PR (or Corporate Social Responsibility) stunt and worst it hurts Google.

Does this sound like a truthful and faithful assessment to you?

Re: After GitHub CEO backs Black Lives Matter, workers demand an end to ICE contract

#832

Post by rattray »

sitkack wrote: post #822
rattray wrote: post #793

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Disclaimer: I am jewish, and found that accusation offensive. After Trump took office, I began reading The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich, to be on guard – I was afraid. The ICE camps are evil, scary, cruel, and probably illegal, but not indicative of the sort of fascism we saw under the Nazis. After all, they functioned similarly under the previous US president, who did not seem to have fascist tendencies. As othe…

You are wrong, and in no way did I equate velvet fascist statements with being close to Nazi Germany. Saying folks have the freedom to leave their job is ridiculous and only reinforces my point.

Sorry, I meant leave their job for a day (vacation). That was unclear.

Re: After GitHub CEO backs Black Lives Matter, workers demand an end to ICE contract

#833

Post by LunaSea »

jrochkind1 wrote: post #825
LunaSea wrote: post #813

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree with you but what I'm trying to explain is that complaining about a topic instead of trying to implement a democratic system to do so is the same as ignoring other people's opinion because they weren't loud enough. If they want their opinion to be taken seriously, they should setup democratic vote among employees to collect votes anonymously about the issue at hand. Proceeding otherwise is simply trying to co…

That's just not how it works in the real world. Saying the only valid option for exerting pressure on your employer is "setting up a democratic vote" is basically saying you should give up on exerting pressure on your employer. Fortunately, in fact, plenty of organized people have been taken seriously, and have effected change, through other means.

> Fortunately

By possibly bypassing the majority's opinion. Also called authoritarianism. Putting pressure in a non-democratic way is silencing people's opinion and similar to censorship.

Re: After GitHub CEO backs Black Lives Matter, workers demand an end to ICE contract

#834

Post by jacobush »

webmaven wrote: post #751
toasterlovin wrote: post #573

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Illegal immigrants are not at all entirely of a single minority group. And even though they are mostly of a single minority group, that fact is incidental to the fact that they are being put in detention facilities, it is not causal .

Incidental and not causal, huh? How certain are you that Canadian refugees (for example) in equivalent numbers would be subjected to similar treatment and held in similar conditions?

"When Canada sends its people, they're not sending their best. They're not sending you. They're not sending you. They're sending people that have lots of problems, and they're bringing those problems with us. They're bringing drugs. They're bringing crime. They're rapists. And some, I assume, are good people."

Re: After GitHub CEO backs Black Lives Matter, workers demand an end to ICE contract

#835

Post by shay_ker »

umvi wrote: post #459
shay_ker wrote: post #325

Just food for thought: If Github backed out, wouldn't someone else fill their spot by using Gitlab? And if so, isn't that transition cost paid for by tax payers? I'm mostly wondering what's the material impact of Github backing out, outside of optics.

Yeah, but then GitLab will be pressured to back out, and then BitBucket will be too, then ICE will use Gitea, but then the pressure will come back to GitHub to boot Gitea off their platform unless they write ICE out of the license, etc. it's a never ending mess that will harm the software development community.

Gitlab is open source, right? Doesn't have to be done by Gitlab the company, could be a consultant.

Re: After GitHub CEO backs Black Lives Matter, workers demand an end to ICE contract

#836

Post by ric2b »

thu2111 wrote: post #784
akiselev wrote: post #232

Earlier quoted context omitted.

ICE is not a person. ICE does not have a "race, political orientation, gender, origin or religion." It is a social construct and a very recent one at that. Denying service to ICE the organization isn't even remotely comparable to denying service to actual human beings.

Religion isn't a person either. That's a social construct. And I keep reading people claiming gender is a social construct too, so I guess discriminating against people on those grounds is fine then. Denying service to ICE the organization isn't even remotely comparable to denying service to actual human beings. Is ICE staffed entirely by robots? How is it not denying service to actual human beings?

You can't see the difference between a christian individual and a church?

Re: After GitHub CEO backs Black Lives Matter, workers demand an end to ICE contract

#837

Post by f1refly »

tharne wrote: post #599
perfmode wrote: post #537

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If you take a paycheck from someone, you're implicitly agreeing to carry out their instructions and their vision for their business what makes you so sure?

That's what employment is. Someone has a bunch of stuff they want done, and someone else agrees to do it in exchange for money.

Yes, that's what unemployment means. This has nothing to do with shared values though. I could absolutely work for some company whose values I don't share if they pay me enough.

Re: After GitHub CEO backs Black Lives Matter, workers demand an end to ICE contract

#838

Post by sitkack »

rattray wrote: post #832
sitkack wrote: post #822

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are wrong, and in no way did I equate velvet fascist statements with being close to Nazi Germany. Saying folks have the freedom to leave their job is ridiculous and only reinforces my point.

Sorry, I meant leave their job for a day (vacation). That was unclear.

Thanks for the clarification. But the separation you are advocating for is in-human.

Re: After GitHub CEO backs Black Lives Matter, workers demand an end to ICE contract

#839

Post by rattray »

sitkack wrote: post #838
rattray wrote: post #832

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry, I meant leave their job for a day (vacation). That was unclear.

Thanks for the clarification. But the separation you are advocating for is in-human.

Sorry, which separation? The desk worker from their desk for a day?

Re: After GitHub CEO backs Black Lives Matter, workers demand an end to ICE contract

#840

Post by pinkfoot »

rattray wrote: post #513
takeda wrote: post #505

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"I'm happy that people are allowed to protest, but I don't think they should protest for causes that I don't agree with" "I think ICE needs reforms, but I don't believe a pressure should be put on them to impose changes" Makes me wonder if you truly support people protesting or even agree that ICE is doing anything wrong.

This just seems like a weird, ineffective way to put pressure on ICE to stop detaining people excessively, inhumanely, or lethally. Anger and outrage are valuable, and it's important that we channel them in the right directions.

Out of curiosity, how does any government detain anyone without - at least as a final resort - lethal force?

[I bet I'll get more downvotes than answers].

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