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Harvard University Won’t Require SAT, ACT for Admissions Next Year

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271–280 of 568 posts

Re: Harvard University Won’t Require SAT, ACT for Admissions Next Year

#271

Caltech is doing this -- actually, they're going test blind -- for two years. I think that's pretty notable, since I trust them to be interested in only admitting students that can pass their physics classes.

It's not a stretch to posit that Caltech is the most competitive university on the planet. Test scores were already a poor indicator for them, since their applicant pool is well outside the effective measurement range of standardized testing.

Re: Harvard University Won’t Require SAT, ACT for Admissions Next Year

#272

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why wouldn't they feel that way? As bad as Trump may be, he isn't trying to keep their kids from following the same successful path.

The same successful path that begins with the US welcoming non-white, non-English-speaking refugees from countries they've bombed? Trump is not actively on the record against all of that?

If they're refugees from South Vietnam, they probably wish the US kept bombing so they didn't have to flee the communists.

Hell, if they were well off in South Vietnam before the communists came, it just goes to show that if your family had the mental foundations necessary for success, even if you hit rock bottom you still have the attitude to climb back up.

Re: Harvard University Won’t Require SAT, ACT for Admissions Next Year

#273

Caltech is doing this -- actually, they're going test blind -- for two years. I think that's pretty notable, since I trust them to be interested in only admitting students that can pass their physics classes.

I'm a PhD student at Caltech. There's also a push to eliminate the GRE as a requirement for graduate admissions, in much the same way as some people want to eliminate the SAT as a requirement for undergraduate admissions. In my opinion both proposals are well-intentioned but ultimately bad ideas.

Why do you think this is a bad idea? Shouldn't it be a data based decision? https://advances.sciencemag.org/content/5/1/eaat7550

Re: Harvard University Won’t Require SAT, ACT for Admissions Next Year

#274
post #115

I have a hard time understanding the logic here. GPAs are essentially useless, so what else do we have to go off of? "Hollistic admissions" processes seem to be even more skewed towards rich kids, as they have far greater opportunities outside of the class room to pad their resumes in exactly the way that colleges look for. This seems entirely backwards to me. If there is a systemic bias in test scores, it is still b…

How else are you going to keep the Asians out?

Identity politics is a cancer. Glad Asians are starting to realize that they were simply the logical next target.

Re: Harvard University Won’t Require SAT, ACT for Admissions Next Year

#276

This recent trend of eliminating the SAT/ACT reads to me like: “Let’s eliminate these measures that allow high performing students to objectively differentiate themselves, in favor of a more opaque admissions process where we can implement discriminatory policies without scrutiny.”

Isn't this a one year experiment due to Covid?

Re: Harvard University Won’t Require SAT, ACT for Admissions Next Year

#277
post #115

I have a hard time understanding the logic here. GPAs are essentially useless, so what else do we have to go off of? "Hollistic admissions" processes seem to be even more skewed towards rich kids, as they have far greater opportunities outside of the class room to pad their resumes in exactly the way that colleges look for. This seems entirely backwards to me. If there is a systemic bias in test scores, it is still b…

My Latin American State university had a nice solution: a 1 year long introductory course open to everyone which you had to pass to formally enter the university, similar to a centrally-administered course on SAT exams.

The system ticked most boxes: poor students had a lot more resources to study and pass the exams, and the evaluation was very correlated to how well you would do in the University compared to doing than a single exam. It also served as a nice introduction of how to properly navigate a University environment.

When I did this course I wasn't happy in spending an extra year studying before starting university, but in retrospect this is a better system than anything else I've seen. Additionally, almost failing one of the maths courses was a wake-up call that made me realise that I couldn't just wing exams like I did during High School

Re: Harvard University Won’t Require SAT, ACT for Admissions Next Year

#278

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Who cares about those? Definitely not the new American left.

Because it's definitely a zero-sum game.

The new American left does treat it as a zero sum game. That is why they focus on disparities instead of universal programs that would eliminate the largest absolute amounts of poverty and suffering.

Re: Harvard University Won’t Require SAT, ACT for Admissions Next Year

#279

As an Asian who went to an Ivy, I welcome this change. Yes, it will mask a policy of keeping the proportion of Asians lower than a race neutral policy. Yes, it's racially discriminatory. Yes, it's somewhat unfair to Asians who are trying to get in. But no, being fair isn't the point of these schools. Nor is having the most academically excellent student population. If you want that, go to Berkeley or CalTech. The poi…

> The point is to provide an exclusive and desirable brand name

Brand names are fundamentally based on merit, not by implementing some initiative that any school can do in a few months. Harvard is Harvard and not some no-name college because of its adherence to a incredibly selective admission process over the years.

Re: Harvard University Won’t Require SAT, ACT for Admissions Next Year

#280
I struggle to understand how this benefits applicants. So long as SAT/ACT is accepted at all, students should (and, mostly likely, will) continue to take them. This is a very obvious illustration of game theory and the Prisoner's Dilemma. [1]

Refusing to accept SAT/ACT scores would cause a profound change. Whether or not that is advisable is a separate discussion. The question begs, if we eliminate the SAT/ACT, and we decry GPAs as non-standardized, then what?

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Game_theory

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