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Osborning the Mac, or not

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Re: Osborning the Mac, or not

#221

Post by scarface74 »

toyg wrote: post #219
scarface74 wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There was nothing in the justice department ruling that forced them to stand still when it came to browser development. Apple moves faster with Safari/WebKit after they started with KHTML. Apple wasn’t exactly a large company when they introduced Safari. They also lost billions of dollars on the console market. Is it even as profitable as the AirPods now? As far as getting in mobile too early. Failing at the Newton d…

> There was nothing in the justice department ruling Between that and the EU ruling that forced them to implement the somewhat-silly browser-choice system, it was a "hostile environment" where the political message was fairly clear. Combined with a situation where IE was effectively dominant, it sapped any appetite to take it forward or take risks with it. > Is [the console market] even as profitable as the AirPods n…

Between that and the EU ruling that forced them to implement the somewhat-silly browser-choice system, it was a "hostile environment" where the political message was fairly clear. Combined with a situation where IE was effectively dominant, it sapped any appetite to take it forward or take risks with it.

There was no browser choice in the US and I believe it lost its lead here first.

Re: Osborning the Mac, or not

#222

Post by pehtis »

jmpman wrote: post #148

I buy iMacs for my personal use, as they spend the majority of the time running Windows 10 for gaming. Sure I could build/buy a dedicated gaming machine, but I like the hardware (Great monitor, quiet, sleek, mostly trouble-free) and my iMac can play any game at 1080p. Without bootcamp support, I’m going to abandon the Mac hardware for personal, and then for business use. There’s no way an ARM processor is going to be…

I lived through both major Mac CPU transitions (68K-PPC and PPC->X86) and in both cases the assumption was that it was impossible for Apple to ship a usable emulator. In both cases Apple proved everyone wrong and in fact the emulator was a major contributing factor to a smooth transition. It simply takes a lot of time for all 3rd party software to be released for the new architecture.

Given how they handled it in the past my guess is that Apple will release a very usable X64 emulator for the ARM and really brag about it at WWDC.

Re: Osborning the Mac, or not

#223

Post by stetrain »

Wowfunhappy wrote: post #170
sjwright wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My prediction of Apple’s moves here are far less dire. These are just predictions mind you, but the point is Apple could do this without ruining the platform for enthusiasts. 1. They’re going to have some kind of breakthrough with x86 emulation where the Apple ARM CPU has a translator, or an accelerator, or a co-processor, or something that will make x86 run at decent speeds. 2. Apple will move to a long term two-CPU…

> 2. Apple will move to a long term two-CPU strategy with ARM on economy and low power SKUs, and Intel chips for the “Pro” SKUs. How is this going to work for developers or Apple? For how many years will everyone need to test and ship universal binaries?

Every iOS app is currently tested in x86 on the Mac simulator and then ARM on the device.

If you ship a Catalyst app that runs on iPad and Mac you are shipping and testing on x86 and ARM.

Apple already splits binaries in the app store and only downloads what is needed for your device (including resources for different device resolutions), so the end user would likely not see an increase in app size.

Re: Osborning the Mac, or not

#224

Post by slantyyz »

scarface74 wrote: post #208
slantyyz wrote: post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Atom-based Surfaces with the Atom x7-8700 - that's the same processor I have in my GPD-Win. It's more than usable for light users. Heck, its built-in GPU outperforms the one in my Surface Pro. While x86 Surface (not-pro) might have been "meant" to compete on price with iPads, I don't think that's how it worked out. I tend to think most of the people who will buy a low end x86 Surface want/need Windows in the firs…

Have you compared the performance of the atom based Surface to the cheapest iPad?

That's an apples and oranges test, and the performance difference doesn't matter. They're for different target markets.

I don't think anyone in their right mind considers a Surface as an alternative to an iPad. Just because they have similar form factors doesn't mean they're substitutes for one another.

The things I run on my atom based handheld are only available on Windows.

Re: Osborning the Mac, or not

#225

Post by slantyyz »

scarface74 wrote: post #204
slantyyz wrote: post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> No one cares about PCs as a business anymore. Is that true? While I get that this isn't scientific proof, there seem to be a lot of Youtubers out there making a decent living off videos of building and reviewing PCs and Macs. Linus Tech Tips has >11M subscribers, Dave2D has 2.7M subscribers, etc.

Have you looked at the profits of every single PC maker? It’s a low margin business. Making money off of YT videos is peanuts in the grand scheme of things.

> Making money off of YT videos is peanuts in the grand scheme of things.

You said "No one cares about PCs as a business anymore."

The popularity of YT videos on new laptops, pcs, etc. seems to suggest that at a non-zero number of people (i.e., greater than "No one") still care about PCs.

Re: Osborning the Mac, or not

#226

Post by diroussel »

kstenerud wrote: post #97

It's actually a brilliant move by Apple. After the new machines are released, all Mac app store apps will just magically work because they were recompiled behind the scenes by Apple to run on ARM. Only independent releases (stuff not in the app store) will have to deal with the shit show, which will also push more developers to the Apple tax. For regular Mac users (who are already using the app store for everything),…

> app store apps will just magically work because they were recompiled behind the scenes

That will be hard to do, as apple doesn't have the source code. They could transcode them from one machine code to another, but this is unlikely. It will be the app developers themselves that will need to recompile. But I'm sure it will be a (relatively) easy process.

Re: Osborning the Mac, or not

#227

Post by scarface74 »

slantyyz wrote: post #225
scarface74 wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have you looked at the profits of every single PC maker? It’s a low margin business. Making money off of YT videos is peanuts in the grand scheme of things.

> Making money off of YT videos is peanuts in the grand scheme of things. You said "No one cares about PCs as a business anymore." The popularity of YT videos on new laptops, pcs, etc. seems to suggest that at a non-zero number of people (i.e., greater than "No one") still care about PCs.

If you want to be pedantic - a few Youtube videos as a business as evidence of a thriving market is about like showing a record store selling vinyl as evidence of a resurgence.

Re: Osborning the Mac, or not

#228

Post by slantyyz »

scarface74 wrote: post #227
slantyyz wrote: post #225

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Making money off of YT videos is peanuts in the grand scheme of things. You said "No one cares about PCs as a business anymore." The popularity of YT videos on new laptops, pcs, etc. seems to suggest that at a non-zero number of people (i.e., greater than "No one") still care about PCs.

If you want to be pedantic - a few Youtube videos as a business as evidence of a thriving market is about like showing a record store selling vinyl as evidence of a resurgence.

Those channels have millions of subscribers and even more views. Maybe it's insignificant in your view, and that's fine.

Re: Osborning the Mac, or not

#229

Post by djrogers »

blt wrote: post #12

I've been pretty unenthusiastic about the idea of replacing my Macbook Pro after they removed the MagSafe connector and HDMI ports. However, if the ARM laptops run cool enough to actually use on your lap, it might be worth it. Knowing today's Apple, though, they'll make it super thin and it will still run hot.

Neither my 16” MBP or my iPad Pro are too hot for lap use. Yes - the 5+ year old laptops you are clinging to were saddled with some occasionally hot intel CPUs but they’ve come a long way.

Re: Osborning the Mac, or not

#230

Post by djrogers »

toyg wrote: post #211
mrkstu wrote: post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Considering that Adobe has been actively porting creative cloud programs to iPad, I'd say the opposite. They've already been optimizing the existing code base for ARM, maybe with a heads up from Apple that this would be a good preparation for changes coming down the pipe on Mac...

"Porting" is a big word, in my limited experience. The i-apps from Adobe are nowhere near their desktop counterparts.

Adobe is on record that those are ports - the core of the app is ported, but individual features don’t all make it over, or make sense on a touch device so you u e a feature disparity.
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