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After GitHub CEO backs Black Lives Matter, workers demand an end to ICE contract

latimes.com

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Re: After GitHub CEO backs Black Lives Matter, workers demand an end to ICE contract

#221

Post by spideymans »

brabel wrote: post #170
jobeirne wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But to expect that a _federal agency_ will be denied service from a private entity, especially for essentially political reasons, is lunacy. Um, think you've got this backwards. Private entities shouldn't have to take on anyone they don't want as customers (for whatever reason - do you have to justify who you do or don't want in your livingroom?), but publicly-funded institutions shouldn't be able to deny service o…

I am strongly against a private business being able to refuse service to a person/organization on political grounds, even when the "victim" may seem to be performing evil actions, as long as it is not breaking any laws. One should not discriminate on the basis of race, political orientation, gender, origin or religion. Refusing service is clearly a form of discrimination. When you aim that towards your own Government…

>I am strongly against a private business being able to refuse service to a person/organization on political grounds, even when the "victim" may seem to be performing evil actions, as long as it is not breaking any laws

If a government was committing acts of genocide, do you believe private enterprise should be compelled to be complicit in these acts?

Re: After GitHub CEO backs Black Lives Matter, workers demand an end to ICE contract

#222

Post by 49531 »

rattray wrote: post #103
jobeirne wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But to expect that a _federal agency_ will be denied service from a private entity, especially for essentially political reasons, is lunacy. Um, think you've got this backwards. Private entities shouldn't have to take on anyone they don't want as customers (for whatever reason - do you have to justify who you do or don't want in your livingroom?), but publicly-funded institutions shouldn't be able to deny service o…

That is true – businesses are legally allowed to refuse service to anyone (apart from protected classes like race or political affiliation, but that probably does not apply here). It's an important right, and probably many businesses would be more profitable and happy if they exercised that right more often. It's still politically dangerous, and would earn a company a lot of enemies and mistrust (as well as some alli…

I think a better way to look at it is that workers should be able to protest working on a machine they find morally wrong. The world might be a better place if people directing resources were required to stop and think "Are the workers going to willingly do this?" before making decisions.

Re: After GitHub CEO backs Black Lives Matter, workers demand an end to ICE contract

#223

Post by jakelazaroff »

ancorevard wrote: post #136
drunkpotato wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Demonstrably and rather obviously untrue. They're violating the law in many instances, including but not limited to the cases of asylum seekers and current green card holders; it's just they're following the evil, xenophobic whims of the current political leadership, who are failing to hold themselves or ICE accountable to the rule of law, so they are, for the moment, getting away with their lawlessness. I hope we ca…

ICE arrests are significantly down under the current administration compared to the previous administration.

This omits the important fact that ICE arrests steeply decreased year–over–year for seven out of Obama’s eight years in office, while arrests have increased year–over–year for two of Trump’s three years [0]. That doesn’t exonerate Obama, but it does say something about the administration that a new president inherits.

[0] https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2020/03/02/how-border-...

Re: After GitHub CEO backs Black Lives Matter, workers demand an end to ICE contract

#224

Post by [deleted] »

seph-reed wrote: post #193
NE2z2T9qi wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Providing standard, regular service to anyone willing to pay for it is almost always the "default" non-political way of doing business. Do you want an ideological purity test to buy a bagel or a car? Refusing to provide a service when you have the capacity to provide it is a much stronger political act because it essentially implies "I hate you so much that I'm willing to harm myself (foregoing profit) in order to th…

I'm sorry, but with power comes responsibility. The poor little CEOs are going to have to recognize that their decisions have consequences, and those consequences must be thought through. They don't just get to play Capitalist without any repercussions because they call themselves non-political. If you have power, you are responsible for what happens with it. It's not just free money.

[deleted]

Re: After GitHub CEO backs Black Lives Matter, workers demand an end to ICE contract

#225

Post by dilandau »

brabel wrote: post #170
jobeirne wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But to expect that a _federal agency_ will be denied service from a private entity, especially for essentially political reasons, is lunacy. Um, think you've got this backwards. Private entities shouldn't have to take on anyone they don't want as customers (for whatever reason - do you have to justify who you do or don't want in your livingroom?), but publicly-funded institutions shouldn't be able to deny service o…

I am strongly against a private business being able to refuse service to a person/organization on political grounds, even when the "victim" may seem to be performing evil actions, as long as it is not breaking any laws. One should not discriminate on the basis of race, political orientation, gender, origin or religion. Refusing service is clearly a form of discrimination. When you aim that towards your own Government…

Even more so since gh is part of Microsoft, a publicly traded company.

Re: After GitHub CEO backs Black Lives Matter, workers demand an end to ICE contract

#226

Post by munchbunny »

fennecfoxen wrote: post #46
mchanson wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We are going through a very strange and extreme period in US History. Corporations are a huge part of the political landscape. Of course workers who are powerful will demand things of their workplaces. All corporations are political. By accepting the ICE contract previously it was political. Now by reversing they would be changing sides. They were already in the political fray.

The idea that all corporations are political is obviously quite true, especially insofar as potentially-everything is political. What's interesting is erosion of the norm that corporations should not be particularly political (picking and choosing customers based on politics, touting allegiance to one specific side). This was once a somewhat stronger (political) norm that has fallen by the wayside as the nation has g…

I think this ultimately comes down to where individuals see effective levers for expressing political opinions at a policy level.

There is very little trust across the entire political spectrum that the US government is an effective policy maker and enforcer. It often feels like our representatives at the state and federal levels no longer represent individuals, and so we've turned to corporations and US government suppliers looking for leverage to force change instead.

Re: After GitHub CEO backs Black Lives Matter, workers demand an end to ICE contract

#227

Post by mtgp1000 »

couchand wrote: post #115
mtgp1000 wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>All corporations are political This is a meaningless statement that people use to justify railroading their personal politics into everything. By making my services available to everyone equally I am emphatically not making a political statement. This same sentiment is effectively turning an increasing proportion of consumers away from entertainment media.

Just because you aren't thinking about the implications of your decisions doesn't make the consequences any less real.

Are you thinking about the consequences of your breathing? Because every breath grants you the oxygen that your body needs to metabolize the food you eat into useful energy for you to fight the power. So even breathing is political!

Again, it's a meaningless statement. We deliberately draw the line somewhere, partly to avoid incessant infighting over pedantic "political" but not actually political things.

Do you want to know how to turn an entire generation of people against your cause? Impose your politics onto them at work and facilitate a culture of suppression and targeting for anyone critical. This is happening all across society right now and the pendndulum is already starting to swing back and when ivory tower CEOs impose their views onto people who just want to do their jobs, the swing only builds momentum

Re: After GitHub CEO backs Black Lives Matter, workers demand an end to ICE contract

#228

Post by chasing »

akerro wrote: post #209
shaggyfrog wrote: post #77

There are a few comments in here already decrying “politicization”. Guess what? Politics are interwoven in every aspect of our lives. You cannot choose to “avoid” them; even suggesting you can be politically neutral is a political stance that comes from a place of privilege, because only the privileged can avoid experiencing negative political consequences inside their bubble. Collaboration with ICE is collaboration…

>Guess what? Politics are interwoven in every aspect of our lives. Yes, but also companies exist literally only to make money. Companies can't exist without workers. Once a company finds itself in a position of conflict of interest between political views of workers and point of existence of the company - where contracts bring money... we're going to see interesting things. I wonder, who will break first? The company…

> Yes, but also companies exist literally only to make money.

False.

Re: After GitHub CEO backs Black Lives Matter, workers demand an end to ICE contract

#229

Post by qchris »

Foxheart wrote: post #133
phoe-krk wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I understand the position, but nowadays Twitter is full of #BlackLivesMatter posts, pride flags can be seen commonly, all while, to bring the two most currently visible things that haven't changed, the sex/race pay gaps are still there, and Black folk are still much more likely to die during police interventions. I guess I'm glad that the recognition and posts from CEOs is there, but posting rainbow flags and "Black…

"... and Black folk are still much more likely to die during police interventions." Care to link to a source?

I try to do my best to assume good faith, but sometimes comments like this make it really hard.

In any case, here's two links. One's from Drexel University, the other is a meta-composition of resources by an organization connected to the Kennedy School at Harvard. Educate yourself.

[1] https://drexel.edu/now/archive/2016/December/Black-Men-3-tim...

[2] https://journalistsresource.org/studies/government/criminal-...

Re: After GitHub CEO backs Black Lives Matter, workers demand an end to ICE contract

#230

Post by livingparadox »

malandrew wrote: post #205
ckocagil wrote: post #196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can ignore politics, but politics will not ignore you. What you're doing is burying your head in the sand, not avoiding.

Not entirely true. The essence of the libertarian platform is a political platform that tries its best to ignore you as an individual and let you be free. If libertarians were running things, you'd be left not entirely but largely alone.

Well, libertarians are not running things. So the government will not be leaving you alone of its own accord.
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