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Julian Assange in Limbo

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Re: Julian Assange in Limbo

#121

Post by fit2rule »

eyelidlessness wrote: post #68
sneak wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He was never charged with rape, and neither of the women who were involved in those cases ever accused him of rape. I encourage you to read their own words.

In case you're not aware, having sex with someone outside the terms they consented to (use of an intact condom, awake and present) is rape. Even if the person who experienced it doesn't explicitly say so.

He was not charged with rape, and the women he consensually had sex with, did not make that claim either. They wanted the police to require him to have an HIV test - this was then transformed into a rape charge. Neither of the women involved have made that claim - it was invented by the investigator in order to kowtow to political pressure from the CIA in Sweden.

Re: Julian Assange in Limbo

#122

Post by dependenttypes »

asjw wrote: post #53
fit2rule wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because he revealed evidence of one of the worst crimes committed by humanity in the last 100 years? 4 million innocent people murdered in illegal wars is a lot of blood on the hands of the American people. And, we all know how much they hate to be embarrassed by such things ..

> one of the worst crimes committed by humanity in the last 100 years? As much as I oppose to US military politics, I think that in the past 100 years there have been much worse crimes than US wars in the middle east. If I think of the worst criminal of the modern era (post WW2) the first name that comes to mind is Vladimir Putin. For once: he wiped a tenth of the entire Chechen population, it's like if someone order…

> For once: he wiped a tenth of the entire Chechen population, it's like if someone ordered the killing of 34 millions of US citizens.

The first Chechen war did not happen under Putin.

> down civilian airplanes

I doubt that he gave his personal command to do that.

Re: Julian Assange in Limbo

#123

Post by kdtsh »

asjw wrote: post #40
AndrewBissell wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It was really Greenwald and Poitras, and the Guardian just happened to be Greenwald's main outlet at the time. However WikiLeaks did help Snowden with his legal defense and flight to asylum in Russia.

> flight to asylum in Russia. Ironically Snowden tweets about freedom of information from Russia, where Putin literally kills journalists

He knows what he’s doing. If he’s quiet about Russia’s crimes against freedom of expression, it’s because he’ll be in serious danger if he says anything about them - and Snowden going under for saying something true doesn’t do him or anyone else any favours, considering if he did drag Russia through the mud we probably wouldn’t learn anything new.

Never forget that he unveiled a domestic and international surveillance and spying program which is unparalleled in all of history. The fact is, for all Russia’s brutality towards journalists, the scale of Snowden’s findings of US crimes against free expression and privacy dwarf anything Putin has ever done - he wishes he could have a domestic spy agency as effective and popular as the NSA.

Re: Julian Assange in Limbo

#124

Post by fit2rule »

jerkstate wrote: post #111
netsharc wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sadly Snowden is in a position where Putin can use him for a trade. One possible scenario I thought is Trump getting desperate and asking Putin for Snowden to be extradited so Trump can rah rah about being the man that got "the traitor". Meanwhile Putin would get whatever it is Putin wants from this trade, because as we know Trump is an unparalleled genius in deals...

Come on. Trump's base thinks Snowden is a patriot. Do you even know Roger Stone?

Snowden is a patriot in my mind, and I'm no Trump supporter. Just because you associate Snowden with Trump, as per standard agitprop victim procedure, doesn't mean that you should ignore the very real criminal behaviour that Snowden revealed to the world. You should probably pay more attention to the fact of illegal behaviour, more than playing cult doll games ..

Re: Julian Assange in Limbo

#125

Post by lostjohnny »

barry-cotter wrote: post #62
asjw wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> one of the worst crimes committed by humanity in the last 100 years? As much as I oppose to US military politics, I think that in the past 100 years there have been much worse crimes than US wars in the middle east. If I think of the worst criminal of the modern era (post WW2) the first name that comes to mind is Vladimir Putin. For once: he wiped a tenth of the entire Chechen population, it's like if someone order…

> If I think of the worst criminal of the modern era (post WW2) the first name that comes to mind is Vladimir Putin. Mao, Pol Pot, Stalin

Or US own creations: Videla, Pinochet, Saddam Hussein, which perspective make US one of the major threat to World's safety.

or Franco and the regime of the colonels in Greece, because dictatorship is not a communist's only trait, as US like to think.

But I think Putin is different

He s not crushing only his own people, like those dictators did, he acts like the leader of an international terrorist organization with full power over an entire nation resources (from energy to army, from media to industry) and when he's not directly in charge, he puts one of his puppets there, changing the constitution or bending the law if he needs it, and that's why I think he's more dangerous.

Putin is a Trump who made it.

Re: Julian Assange in Limbo

#126

Post by lostjohnny »

runawaybottle wrote: post #103
dependenttypes wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> who’s also a narcissist What makes you think that? Even if he is though, so what? > he doesn’t deserve to be exonerated for the actual crimes he committed Certainly, although I think that the 8 years that he spent in the embassy are more than enough of a punishment for the condom crime. > and he doesn’t deserve to be treated as a hero for accepting a role as an agent of weaponized information for a global fascist m…

I personally no longer accept the classification of narcissism. Something so general that it’s based on Greek mythology (embarrassing ultimately, that a pseudo scientific field seeking legitimacy resorts to a fictional parallel - yep, that’s the way to do it, just read the wikis on Narcissistic supply, and you wonder if the hacks haven’t taken control of the wheel and done a full blown imitation of Freud. The modern…

> I personally no longer accept the classification of narcissism

Narcisism is a personality disorder, it's not just a trait of humans, it's not just self absorbtion

Narcisism is a mental health issue

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Personality_disorder#Cluster_B...

Re: Julian Assange in Limbo

#127

Post by stunt »

Please don't just carelessly comment about WAR as something minor and justifiable. With all the power, wealth, and facilities, it took us only a few months of pandemic pressure, a few weeks with fear of tear gas, and violence on streets. So many hearts broke, so many men cried, system often failed to control, many felt hopeless, and so many got depressed because of uncertainty.

And yet we carelessly talk about WAR as if everything about it is small and normal that nobody should be held accountable and we should do all of it and non of it is our problem. We do all that talking without really knowing anything about it. Media just made it so easy for people to do that and that's how we don't put any effort to stop wars.

Re: Julian Assange in Limbo

#128

Post by fsflover »

ephemeralism wrote: post #113
dang wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you click on a grayed-out comment's timestamp, it should take you to the comment's own page and the text there should be readable. There's no approach here that doesn't suck. The fading of downvoted comments has downsides, but I think not doing it would have more downsides. It's really important for there to be visual signals of when the community doesn't support something, because in the absence of such signals,…

Could this not be achieved in some other way that doesn't hurt the readability? Or at least a choice to turn it off or down in settings. Squinting your eyes, highlighting the text or going to a separate page really breaks the flow of reading.

I actually like this feature. If I want to read a downvoted comment, I just highlight its text with a mouse.

Re: Julian Assange in Limbo

#129

Post by jpgvm »

jedberg wrote: post #26
Retric wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In what way is getting sent files illegal? Last I checked the only protection on classified information was for people that had a clearance at some point. Which is why journalists can generally publish classified information.

It's illegal to keep something you know was stolen.

Information was copied, not stolen. This is about as correct as arguments around piracy equating downloading a film to stealing a car. The other party still has the information, it's not stolen.

In the case of a movie it was illegally copied, this is illegal under copyright law but is NOT stealing.

Copying classified information you have been granted access to by the military because of your security clearance is illegal and punishable by court marshall but it's NOT stealing.

A journalist disclosing classified information IS legal and always has been. If it wasn't then all of the journalists that published the cables in NYTimes and friends would be guilty of the same charges as Assange, i.e copying classified information from some source on the Internet and then disclosing it to their readers/viewers.

However there is potentially SOME argument that Assange may be running afoul of the Espionage act because he is ACCUSED of aiding and abetting a member of the US military in exfiltrating classified information. This is illegal but it's definition is so broad that it would most likely need to be heard by the Supreme Court to clarify.

i.e he isn't being charged with stealing because he didn't steal shit. He isn't being charged with disclosing secrets because that is legal. He is being charged with helping someone do something illegal and that is entirely different.

Re: Julian Assange in Limbo

#130

Post by fractallyte »

fractallyte wrote: post #105
barry-cotter wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If I think of the worst criminal of the modern era (post WW2) the first name that comes to mind is Vladimir Putin. Mao, Pol Pot, Stalin

Yes, and one would think that after all those examples of fine leadership, us 'civilized' nations would have learned a thing or two? Putin's regime carried out these crimes in the Caucasus in the 21st century (and earlier), and they are continuing even as you read this comment...

OK, for the people who disagree with my comment, here is the reason we should support investigative journalism:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_journalists_killed_in_...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_government_censorship_...

Chechnya has been essentially cut off - considering its recent history, any guesses why??

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