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Ask HN: Is working as a developer on technical route until retirement feasible?

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Re: Ask HN: Is working as a developer on technical route until retirement feasible?

#91

Post by burntoutfire »

travisjungroth wrote: post #87
aerophilic wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Absolutely! Software is a huge multiplication factor. No argument there! However the point, which maybe I didn’t make clearly, is this: they expect a specific multiplication factor from a specific bit of code. This is the value X they hope to achieve by employing you. If you can do X in less time/lower overall cost then someone else, then that is worth paying more for. However, that X benefit they are seeking is rela…

I still don’t get why you think that the budget for sharing productivity gains is strictly more bounded for software engineers than managers. I could flip your example around. McDonald’s hopes to achieve value X from each of their managers and that’s what their willing to pay. But a software engineer who can increase retention rates can noticeably increase the value of the whole company. And that’s part of why one ge…

Modern software engineer is in most cases just a bricklayer - he just realises a vision of the business (product owner and his boss etc.). So, in your example, it's not the software engineer who increased retention rates, but rather the manager who thought of writing such improvement, and hired an engineer who then implemented it.

In other words, the implementation is seen as a trivial part of the process, while figuring out what exactly to implement is seen as the core of the value creation.

Re: Ask HN: Is working as a developer on technical route until retirement feasible?

#92

Post by burntoutfire »

Thorentis wrote: post #71
brentis wrote: post #63

Great topic. The cognitive load of full stack development at > 45 to me seems unbearable. I love building products, but after doing the basics for the 1000th time gets old. I would imagine the appreciable parallel being similar to a backend dev having to do UI work. At my age I no longer want to look at a monitor any more and want to think and have others build products, so went i to product. The pay question is inte…

How on earth do you get a couple million in the bank by 45?

Save $50k a year for 20 years, and then ride on the massive bull run that the US stock market has been in the past 10 years.

Alternatively, save $100k a year and just realize more moderate stock growth.

Re: Ask HN: Is working as a developer on technical route until retirement feasible?

#93

Post by wmeredith »

burntoutfire wrote: post #89
BurningFrog wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ah. So I'm just too white for the reference :)

Rap in that era was made for white middleclass people, as it's they who could afford to buy the most CDs.

Ha! Yes, most definitely an age thing. Not a race thing. I grew up very white in the Midwest and this music was very much a part of the zeitgeist.

Re: Ask HN: Is working as a developer on technical route until retirement feasible?

#94

Post by wmeredith »

Aeolun wrote: post #49
jedberg wrote: post #39

I worked with a guy in his 60s when I was in my 20s just starting out. He did good work and was a fine coworker. He also made the same amount as the guys who were senior engineers in their 30s. His salary growth basically plateaued in his 30s, after that it was just COL adjustments. He was perfectly fine with that though. He enjoyed being a coder, got paid enough to support his lifestyle, and liked that he got to shu…

I don’t know, I just cannot see myself not being rewarded with any kind of raise for the next 30 years as a good thing.

This growth mindset is at the core of HN/startup culture. But at some point other stuff starts to matter more than money. Autonomy, growth, and mastery come to mind.

Re: Ask HN: Is working as a developer on technical route until retirement feasible?

#95

Post by beardyw »

My story: My very first job was as COBOL programmer aged 20. I was made team leader after a couple of years and found it was a great job for me. You are hands on but you get to be involved in more stuff. I stayed in that sort of role for pretty much the rest of my career, sometimes with a team, sometimes on a team. Out of 43 years I spent about 7 years in the middle away from coding in management and sales. They were not my happiest time but I got paid well and I am sitting in a house it helped buy. Make of that what you like.

My problem when in my 50s was putting up with how ridiculous some of the people I worked with seemed to be. Shoehorning in the latest (now obsolete) technology where it did not benefit the end result was common. In the end I settled into being a Java full stack contractor, remote from internal discussions, just getting on with doing a good job. I retired myself from that at 63.

Re: Ask HN: Is working as a developer on technical route until retirement feasible?

#96

Post by joe202 »

I'm now old enough to retire if I wanted but intend to go on for another ~5y. Worked at the first place for 26y (3/4 different employers, mostly takeovers). When I got made redundant, I retrained as a teacher, which I stayed at for 5y. Managed to find another dev. job which I've been at for 10y. Could go higher and still be entirely technical but would be expected to mainly manage a few levels up. Still have to learn new things and am happy to.

Re: Ask HN: Is working as a developer on technical route until retirement feasible?

#98

Post by jacobtoronto »

sebajuarez wrote: post #76
Thorentis wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How on earth do you get a couple million in the bank by 45?

how do you get to not divorce? :)

One spouse cannot control the decisions of the other. If one spouse is bound and determined to leave the marriage, then I'm not sure there's much that can be done. However, I know from experience that as long as both are willing to try to save the marriage, there is hope, even with disagreements that seem painful and impossible. Counseling can help. Maintaining a positive vision of the future -- hope -- is motivating and can change one's perspective on the spouse. I don't mean to diminish your concern -- I acknowledge it: marriage is not easy! But I also believe there is a way to stay together in many instances, and that doing so is worth the risk and the sacrifice.

Re: Ask HN: Is working as a developer on technical route until retirement feasible?

#99

Post by rossdavidh »

huydotnet wrote: post #26
rossdavidh wrote: post #8

I _started_ working as a coder in my 30's, and I'm 52 now. I am still getting inquiries from startups. One thing that trips up some coders as they get older, is that on some level they expect to be able to stop learning new stuff, and settle into the role of grizzled veteran. While that is true in most fields, in software, it just isn't. If you are retiring in 5 years, you'd better be learning some new stuff now to b…

I am curious, a side from keep learning, did you do anything, like, kind of promote your personal skills/archivements, to make sure you're "visible" to potential employers or something?

Your best route to potential employers is to have been regarded as both productive and easy to work with at your previous gigs. Reputation spreads, one way or the other.

Re: Ask HN: Is working as a developer on technical route until retirement feasible?

#100

Post by rossdavidh »

warmcat wrote: post #50
rossdavidh wrote: post #8

I _started_ working as a coder in my 30's, and I'm 52 now. I am still getting inquiries from startups. One thing that trips up some coders as they get older, is that on some level they expect to be able to stop learning new stuff, and settle into the role of grizzled veteran. While that is true in most fields, in software, it just isn't. If you are retiring in 5 years, you'd better be learning some new stuff now to b…

Can you guide what your routine is for learning new stuff and staying up to date? How have you managed to work and study to stay relevant and keep up with young people going into the industry every day?

1) You don't actually have to "keep up" with young people learning, in the sense that they will inevitably be quicker learners. But, you can compensate by being better targeted at figuring out what to learn, which is where seeing tech fads come and go is helpful. But, you do have to keep learning. 2) The best routine is more than I can claim to know, but using new stuff to do something you're interested in (e.g. use an unfamiliar library or framework to analyze some real-world data, or build a small website for a real-world purpose) is the way that works for me. Tutorials are fine, but you need to use it for something "real", although not necessarily work-related.
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