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Capitol Hill Autonomous Zone

capitolhillautonomous.zone

21–30 of 920 posts

Re: Capitol Hill Autonomous Zone

#21
post #16

Seattle police vacated the east precinct, fully expecting protesters to burn it down. Instead, the protesters set up an open zone, compiled a set of demands, and from all accounts set up something cool and unique. Here's hoping it sustains itself for a while.

No, not even remotely "by all accounts". There are plenty of accounts that isn't "cool and unique" but is just another place ruled by violent thugs: https://www.reddit.com/r/Seattle/comments/h077uv/raz_simone_...

I'm not passing judgment yet since the days are young and the political bias on the ground is thick in both directions. But it is definitely not "by all accounts".

But my personal bias on the table is that yeah, trading police that were imperfectly constrained by the system for new police utterly and entirely unconstrained by the system is probably not going to go well. The real "fun" will start when Raz's faction pisses off enough people to form a violent counterfaction and you get a gang war, so give it a bit. It takes time for these things to develop. Let the honeymoon wear off and have this place showing a functioning system for, oh, say, at least a month before declaring victory. Not that you declared victory, I'm just saying, I recommend against getting too invested in this.

It's not as if "a place that has no police" is some shocking new experiment that has never been run before; you've got plenty of places you can look out in the world to see what happens next. It's not a difficult-to-predict progression.

Re: Capitol Hill Autonomous Zone

#22
post #12
post #6

From Wikipedia: Animal Farm by G.Orwell "The book tells the story of a group of farm animals who rebel against their human farmer, hoping to create a society where the animals can be equal, free, and happy. Ultimately, however, the rebellion is betrayed, and the farm ends up in a state as bad as it was before, under the dictatorship of a pig named Napoleon." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Animal_Farm

One reddit thread suggests it is already heading that way. https://www.reddit.com/r/Seattle/comments/h077uv/raz_simone_...

From the OP of that post:

>tl;dw: Man was tagging over someone else's art, Raz and group approach and separate him from crowd, chasing him for two blocks. He begins to film them with his phone, they take it from him. He tries to get it back and they attack him, kicking him in the head and breaking his glasses. At one point, Raz threatens to shoot the man. They then begin to gaslight him that it was all his fault. Audio only for most of the end, because woman in Raz' crew filming puts the phone in her pocket while the stream continues. [1]

So it took about 3 days for this anarchist utopia to demonstrate exactly why police exist.

[1] https://www.reddit.com/r/Seattle/comments/h077uv/raz_simone_...

Re: Capitol Hill Autonomous Zone

#23

According to a June 10 article by City Journal, hip hop artist Raz Simone acts as "co-leader and enforcer" of the Zone, while former mayoral candidate Nikkita Oliver formulates the commune's political aims.[24] However, according to Simone, the Zone has no central leadership, with all residents serving as leaders https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capitol_Hill_Autonomous_Zone

I've lived in a neighborhood with an "enforcer". Let's just say most of us were happy when the police showed up from time to time.

Re: Capitol Hill Autonomous Zone

#25

According to a June 10 article by City Journal, hip hop artist Raz Simone acts as "co-leader and enforcer" of the Zone, while former mayoral candidate Nikkita Oliver formulates the commune's political aims.[24] However, according to Simone, the Zone has no central leadership, with all residents serving as leaders https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capitol_Hill_Autonomous_Zone

I've lived in a neighborhood with an "enforcer". Let's just say most of us were happy when the police showed up from time to time.

Living in a neighborhood in Oakland CA with no enforcer and annoyingly blatant property crime, I’m willing to give an enforcer a try cause it’s not like people trust the police here or that they even come when you call them.

Re: Capitol Hill Autonomous Zone

#26
post #7

I wonder if it's bigger than Sealand: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Principality_of_Sealand When I look at the list of demands I'm pretty quick to dismiss it. Then I remember how I dismissed the 1999 WTO protests in Seattle too, and how many of the fears those protesters had were realized over the next two decades. I might be too hopeful, but I really think the city leadership should talk to them and hear them out, i…

The list of demands came from an open mic discussion. They let anyone come up and suggest a demand.

Someonen transcribed those demands and then posted them.

I think it would be better to view those demands as the union of demands of each person willing to speak to a crowd. Which is why you see inconsistency in then, why it's such a long list, etc.

I just think that list of demands is better understood in that context.

Re: Capitol Hill Autonomous Zone

#28
post #6

From Wikipedia: Animal Farm by G.Orwell "The book tells the story of a group of farm animals who rebel against their human farmer, hoping to create a society where the animals can be equal, free, and happy. Ultimately, however, the rebellion is betrayed, and the farm ends up in a state as bad as it was before, under the dictatorship of a pig named Napoleon." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Animal_Farm

Wow you are really smart! What an insightful reference. See ya in home room

Re: Capitol Hill Autonomous Zone

#29
post #7

I wonder if it's bigger than Sealand: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Principality_of_Sealand When I look at the list of demands I'm pretty quick to dismiss it. Then I remember how I dismissed the 1999 WTO protests in Seattle too, and how many of the fears those protesters had were realized over the next two decades. I might be too hopeful, but I really think the city leadership should talk to them and hear them out, i…

The list of demands came from an open mic discussion. They let anyone come up and suggest a demand. Someonen transcribed those demands and then posted them. I think it would be better to view those demands as the union of demands of each person willing to speak to a crowd. Which is why you see inconsistency in then, why it's such a long list, etc. I just think that list of demands is better understood in that context…

Its not a list of demands if it's ridiculous and can't be realistically filled. At that point its just a list of wishes.

Re: Capitol Hill Autonomous Zone

#30
post #12
post #6

From Wikipedia: Animal Farm by G.Orwell "The book tells the story of a group of farm animals who rebel against their human farmer, hoping to create a society where the animals can be equal, free, and happy. Ultimately, however, the rebellion is betrayed, and the farm ends up in a state as bad as it was before, under the dictatorship of a pig named Napoleon." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Animal_Farm

One reddit thread suggests it is already heading that way. https://www.reddit.com/r/Seattle/comments/h077uv/raz_simone_...

All their food was stolen by homeless people as well: https://twitter.com/redsteeze/status/1270731506890113024
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